Red Mosquito • View topic - Self-conscious "return to form" albums

tragabigzanda · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 8:23 pm

Anders wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

What form do you guys think they’re returning to on that album? The deconstructionist experimentalism of YHF/AGIB? Or the alt-country vibes of AM/BT? Because apart from a few specific songs, I don’t find any of that stuff to be overwhelmingly present on TWL.

Aren’t we talking less about the result, and more about the marketing?

I thought we were talking about the artistic intentions when making the album, but I may be mistaken.

Anders wrote:

Sky Blue Sky is the better album.

If you're comparing it to TWL, then yes, by a humongous margin!

Jorge · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 8:49 pm

tragabigzanda wrote:

What form do you guys think they’re returning to on that album? The deconstructionist experimentalism of YHF/AGIB? Or the alt-country vibes of AM/BT? Because apart from a few specific songs, I don’t find any of that stuff to be overwhelmingly present on TWL.

I'm hesitant to defend my original call here because as I've already admitted I barely listened to The Whole Love (or any Wilco in the last 10 years). But I can give you an idea of what I had in mind and maybe Wilco fans can tell me if I'm wrong.

My recollection is that there was a growing sense of displeasure among Wilco fans about how their career was going after A Ghost is Born. Their next releases, Sky Blue Sky and Wilco (the Album), were seen as too safe, bland and dad-rocky. Wilco had established themselves as this experimental pop-rock band over the last several albums, and then those two seemed to be mostly staid and conventional. I distinctly remember conversations (probably even here) about how weird it was that they recruited this avant garde jazz guitarist guy and then proceeded to make some of the most boring and straightforward music of their career.

In this context, I remember The Whole Love coming out and the fanbase blowing a collective load about how "they're back!" and how cool it was that they opened with a weirdo glitched-out song like "Art of Almost". That is about as much as I got into the album, so I don't know if the rest of it follows in this spirit. I feel completely unconfident about everything I am writing in this post.

washing machine · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 8:53 pm

So many wars that just can't be won, oh, oh, oh
Even before the battle's begun, oh, oh, oh
This is all of our arms open wide
Sonic shoulder for you to cry, cry, cry, on
Wilco, Wilco will love you, baby

tragabigzanda · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 9:37 pm

Jorge wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

What form do you guys think they’re returning to on that album? The deconstructionist experimentalism of YHF/AGIB? Or the alt-country vibes of AM/BT? Because apart from a few specific songs, I don’t find any of that stuff to be overwhelmingly present on TWL.

I'm hesitant to defend my original call here because as I've already admitted I barely listened to The Whole Love (or any Wilco in the last 10 years). But I can give you an idea of what I had in mind and maybe Wilco fans can tell me if I'm wrong.

My recollection is that there was a growing sense of displeasure among Wilco fans about how their career was going after A Ghost is Born. Their next releases, Sky Blue Sky and Wilco (the Album), were seen as too safe, bland and dad-rocky. Wilco had established themselves as this experimental pop-rock band over the last several albums, and then those two seemed to be mostly staid and conventional. I distinctly remember conversations (probably even here) about how weird it was that they recruited this avant garde jazz guitarist guy and then proceeded to make some of the most boring and straightforward music of their career.

In this context, I remember The Whole Love coming out and the fanbase blowing a collective load about how "they're back!" and how cool it was that they opened with a weirdo glitched-out song like "Art of Almost". That is about as much as I got into the album, so I don't know if the rest of it follows in this spirit. I feel completely unconfident about everything I am writing in this post.

hey, you know what? You've convinced me I was wrong. :hooray:

Jorge · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 10:49 pm

I wasn't prepared for this

tragabigzanda · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 11:01 pm

Imagine how great my wife feels when she hears me say those same words a few times a year.

Chris_H_2 · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 11:09 pm

what people forget about wilco is that the arrival of nels cline coincided with jeff tweady taking full reins of the songwriting process (whereas before it was shared with jay bennett up until YHF, and with jim o'rourke on both YHF and AGIB). the direction that the band took after that is all jeff tweady.

so i blame jeff tweady.

tragabigzanda · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 11:19 pm

Chris_H_2 wrote:

what people forget about wilco is that the arrival of nels cline coincided with jeff tweady taking full reins of the songwriting process (whereas before it was shared with jay bennett up until YHF, and with jim o'rourke on both YHF and AGIB). the direction that the band took after that is all jeff tweady.

so i blame jeff tweady.

you know the guy and you can't spell his name right? :shake:

In all seriousness, does O'Rourke actually get songwriting credit for those albums? Wasn't it just production and mixing?

Chris_H_2 · **Posted:** Tue February 09, 2021 11:31 pm

tragabigzanda wrote:

Chris_H_2 wrote:

what people forget about wilco is that the arrival of nels cline coincided with jeff tweady taking full reins of the songwriting process (whereas before it was shared with jay bennett up until YHF, and with jim o'rourke on both YHF and AGIB). the direction that the band took after that is all jeff tweady.

so i blame jeff tweady.

you know the guy and you can't spell his name right? :shake:

In all seriousness, does O'Rourke actually get songwriting credit for those albums? Wasn't it just production and mixing?

Spellcheck

He definitely helped rearrange Spiders, Muzzle of Bees, Less Than You Think, and At Least That’s What You Said, but I think he only got compositional credit for LTYT.

I can’t wait for the next Loose Fur album. Tweedy said they’re still writing it.

oasisfan35 · **Joined:** Tue January 01, 2013 3:07 pm **Posts:** 3368

Dave Matthews Band's Away from the World definitely falls into this category, even going so far as to work with the original producer that was at the helm of their big three releases.

spike · **Joined:** Wed January 02, 2013 4:18 am **Posts:** 28100

whatever Garth Brooks released after that Chris Gaines crap

spike · **Joined:** Wed January 02, 2013 4:18 am **Posts:** 28100

Wilco’s return to form was Ode to Joy. Most interesting record they’ve put out since AGiB.

washing machine · **Posted:** Sat February 13, 2021 9:34 pm

Let the record show that spike got in an edit of "Not interesting record they've put out in years" before the clock ran out.

dad · **Joined:** Fri June 24, 2016 2:49 pm **Posts:** 16527

spike wrote:

Wilco’s return to form was Ode to Joy. Most interesting record they’ve put out since AGiB.

I think you misspelled Star Wars.

verb_to_trust · **Posted:** Sat February 13, 2021 10:21 pm

dad wrote:

spike wrote:

Wilco’s return to form was Ode to Joy. Most interesting record they’ve put out since AGiB.

I think you misspelled Star Wars.

Ode to Joy is pretty boring. You have to be in exact right mood for it to hit you. That's not the same thing as putting on YHF or agib.

verb_to_trust · **Posted:** Sat February 13, 2021 10:23 pm

Chris_H_2 wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

Chris_H_2 wrote:

what people forget about wilco is that the arrival of nels cline coincided with jeff tweady taking full reins of the songwriting process (whereas before it was shared with jay bennett up until YHF, and with jim o'rourke on both YHF and AGIB). the direction that the band took after that is all jeff tweady.

so i blame jeff tweady.

you know the guy and you can't spell his name right? :shake:

In all seriousness, does O'Rourke actually get songwriting credit for those albums? Wasn't it just production and mixing?

Spellcheck

He definitely helped rearrange Spiders, Muzzle of Bees, Less Than You Think, and At Least That’s What You Said, but I think he only got compositional credit for LTYT.

I can’t wait for the next Loose Fur album. Tweedy said they’re still writing it.

Is it going to be a zoom album though? Loose Fur by email has me a little concerned.

Jorge · **Posted:** Wed February 09, 2022 3:54 am

Jorge wrote:

I count a whopping FOUR for EC:

Blood & Chocolate
Brutal Youth
When I Was Cruel (definitely marketed this way, though it contains some unusual sounds for him)
Momofuku

+ The Boy Named If, probably

Malloy · **Joined:** Wed January 02, 2013 4:57 am **Posts:** 2819

verb_to_trust wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

Jorge wrote:

Also, wasn't Wilco's The Whole Love kind of this? I didn't get into it too much but I vaguely remember track 1 "Art of Almost" feeling kind of like the band going "don't worry guys -- we can still get weird!"

Hard disagree. I don't know that they've ever made a return to form album, because each album is its own animal. Only Wilco (The Album) feels like an attempt at crowd pleasing, but it fell in their discography more as a collection of everything they'd done before rather than an attempt to gain back lost fans.

Pretty sure strat is the only Wilco fan who's been disappointed since Nels joines.

Jay Bennett over Nels any day and twice on leap year

jim orouke over them all

Malloy · **Joined:** Wed January 02, 2013 4:57 am **Posts:** 2819

Gaucho

Malloy · **Joined:** Wed January 02, 2013 4:57 am **Posts:** 2819

wait, no Katy Lied

Self-conscious "return to form" albums

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