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Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 5:49 pm
I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:53 pm Posts: 12081
Jorge wrote:
BurtReynolds wrote:
but then again bureaucratic corporate behemoths are often very stupid, so we'll see if they are right I guess.
Yeah
HBO Max is still lagging behind Disney+, Amazon Prime, and Netflix in terms of subscriptions. I don't think they got as much juice from the day-of streaming release experiment as they were hoping, or at least that seems to be the common impression
The day of streaming release model is a failure but the WB execs pushed it hard and are doubling down on the off chance it might still work and they get to keep their jobs after the merger. Its a bad strategy and they are gonna be on the street.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 6:03 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 46972 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
Just imagine you’re the CEO of AT&T, and your assistant buzzes you:
“Sir, on line 1 you’ve got Denis Villeneuve. He’s pissed. He says that even though there’s a pandemic, he’s blaming you for losing $400M at the box office. Then on line 2 you’ve got the ambassador to China. He wants to know how fast you can get 5G into the homes of 1.5B Chinese so they can finally watch The Righteous Gemstones for $7.99/mo.”
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 6:31 pm
I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:53 pm Posts: 12081
Breaking into the China market, which lets face it is and will always be an iffy proposition, and releasing theatrical movies day and date on a streaming platform that only exist in the US doesn't really seem to go together in my imagination. Especially since AT&T sold the movie division to Discovery. Disney seemed to learn their lesson and released their Kung Fu Marvel movie theatrical only and made a bunch of money they would have just given away. Dune is doing well theatrically world wide. Releasing it on HBO Max the day before theatrical is a doubling down of a bad idea. They aren't getting huge bumps in subs from this strategy and even if they did and people loved getting these movies right away what is going to happen when as you suggest they move away from it and you have to go to the theater again? Hope people are too lazy to cancel like their gym membership?
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 6:36 pm
I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 1:53 pm Posts: 10253 Location: in the air tonight
The future of television is television. This moment of big movies being released on streaming platforms is temporary, as the big players try to fight for space in the streaming wars and establish themselves as major players there. But the streaming platforms will eventually focus on series. Big movies will go back to the cinema before long. Disney's current model of big franchise movies in the cinema being followed by spin-off series on streaming is going to be the model for a lot of these companies. But I don't think the cinema is going anywhere. Give it a couple years to settle
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 6:40 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 46972 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
The Argonaut wrote:
The future of television is television. This moment of big movies being released on streaming platforms is temporary, as the big players try to fight for space in the streaming wars and establish themselves as major players there. But the streaming platforms will eventually focus on series. Big movies will go back to the cinema before long. Disney's current model of big franchise movies in the cinema being followed by spin-off series on streaming is going to be the model for a lot of these companies. But I don't think the cinema is going anywhere. Give it a couple years to settle
Yeah I agree with this to an extent. Big question is at what point does VR become so good and so ubiquitous that people “go to the movies” from their couch?
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sat October 16, 2021 6:50 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 46972 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
bada wrote:
Breaking into the China market, which lets face it is and will always be an iffy proposition, and releasing theatrical movies day and date on a streaming platform that only exist in the US doesn't really seem to go together in my imagination. Especially since AT&T sold the movie division to Discovery. Disney seemed to learn their lesson and released their Kung Fu Marvel movie theatrical only and made a bunch of money they would have just given away. Dune is doing well theatrically world wide. Releasing it on HBO Max the day before theatrical is a doubling down of a bad idea. They aren't getting huge bumps in subs from this strategy and even if they did and people loved getting these movies right away what is going to happen when as you suggest they move away from it and you have to go to the theater again? Hope people are too lazy to cancel like their gym membership?
Read the article I posted above. It’s not as simple as “sold their movie division to Discovery.” The deal’s pretty complicated, but they’re set to walk a fine line of being two separate entities with deeply integrated finances.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sun October 17, 2021 3:47 am
Future Drummer
Joined: Wed January 02, 2013 4:57 am Posts: 2819
Jorge wrote:
I dunno, but it's not only harming the movies' box office returns, I think it's also hurting their "cultural standing." Probably a bad way to phrase it but I mean like their overall cultural penetration. Their release feels much more fleeting, less important. VENOM 2 felt like a bigger deal than The Suicide Squad (even though there are obviously other factors at play there, like confusion about whether TSS was a reboot or a sequel or a Snyder-like director's cut or what)
hard yes
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Jorge wrote:
I remember I was in Miami when it happened. I was posting from the balcony of my apartment overlooking the beach. And I was having an argument with Adamdude.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Sun October 17, 2021 3:52 am
Future Drummer
Joined: Wed January 02, 2013 4:57 am Posts: 2819
Simple Torture wrote:
I am watching Do The Right Thing for the first time and did a quick Google search for the younger Italian brother, realized, "Oh, yeah! He's one of the parking garage attendants from Ferris Beuller." (The guy on the right in the gif below.)
I remember I was in Miami when it happened. I was posting from the balcony of my apartment overlooking the beach. And I was having an argument with Adamdude.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Mon October 18, 2021 3:26 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 46972 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
The article is fine, basically reiterates the arguments we've all been making here. I disagree with a fundamental premise of his argument:
Quote:
The world of “Dune,” like the world of “Lawrence of Arabia” or the original “Blade Runner,” needs to overwhelm and envelop you. But if you watch it at home, the film’s narrative — is Paul Atreides the Messiah? Watch the House Atreides go down to defeat… and look out for that sandworm! — is going to stand revealed as the rather patchy affair it is. When you shrink the grandeur of “Dune,” you shrink its appeal.
I think with three sentences, he completely disregards the advances made in home theater technology. Not everyone has a 4K HDR 65" TV with surround sound... But a lot of people do. And even my modest 55" 4K + sound bar setup isn't too shabby with the lights off and a bowl of popcorn, right on my own couch. Yes, stuff can be more awe-inspiring on a huge screen, but I don't think the difference in experience is as vast as he's making it out to be.
And he completely neglects a key aspect of AT&T's goal here: to (as a result of sub numbers) free up cash to more aggressively develop 5G infrastructure, which will then generate revenue from their competitors.
If you're a movie studio employee; a lifelong fan of Frank Herbert; or a stakeholder in the brick-and-mortar theater business, then I totally understand why this decision feels wrong to you. But to everyone else, it's kind of like "who cares?" If you want to see it in the theater, you have the option; if you want to stay home, you have the option. They've already recouped $75M in the foreign market, so they'll get their other $90M back between theatrical, Blu-Ray, and new subs. They developed this day-and-date model and had to commit to it, so any holiday blockbuster that came out this year was subject to that model.
And another thing no one has mentioned yet is the continued growth of green screen technology. The implicit concern here seems to be that if Dune performs poorly, we'll get less massively awe-inspiring film productions. But I just don't buy it. Between the de-aging of DeNiro, fake Tom Cruise, and the digital backdrops of Dune, we're well on our way to having the majority of our fantastical tales cobbled together on a bunch of computers.
Though I still intend to to see Dune in the theater, FWIW. All my arguments here are just from a practical business standpoint.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Mon October 18, 2021 3:33 pm
Guys, I am not a moderator! I swear to God! Why does everyone think I'm a moderator?
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 2:48 pm Posts: 47184
tragabigzanda wrote:
And another thing no one has mentioned yet is the continued growth of green screen technology. The implicit concern here seems to be that if Dune performs poorly, we'll get less massively awe-inspiring film productions. But I just don't buy it. Between the de-aging of DeNiro, fake Tom Cruise, and the digital backdrops of Dune, we're well on our way to having the majority of our fantastical tales cobbled together on a bunch of computers.
We're getting 4 more Avatar movies and no one can stop it. So yeah
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Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Mon October 18, 2021 4:53 pm
I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 1:53 pm Posts: 10253 Location: in the air tonight
I get a little bored of the "the underperformance of this specific film means that this type of film is dead forever and will never be made again" take. It's never been true and it won't be. I'm seeing takes that because 'The Last Duel' isn't making money, it's going to be the last drama film with movie stars. Give me a break. If Dune doesn't do great, they aren't going to abandon big VFX sci-fi movies. They just might not make another Dune movie and six Dune TV shows. Oh no! They'll try again with an N.K. Jemisin property or whatever. Every type of movie is going to keep getting made. I was listening to a podcast with a documentary filmmaker who had made a funny movie about some sado masochist in the eighties and he said something about how they wouldn't let him make that movie in today's market. Bullshit. This year on HBO, on 'How to...with John Wilson', we went into the bedroom of a man who wants to grow his foreskin back and we saw a demonstration of his homemade apparatus in which he got completely naked and tied a rope around the end of his dick and pulled on it. That was on TV. If they stop making a certain kind of movie, it's not because one movie didn't do well. It's because that type of movie has been done to death and there is nothing left to say.
Post subject: Re: Post Random Movie-Related Thoughts You Have
Posted: Mon October 18, 2021 6:42 pm
I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:53 pm Posts: 12081
Jorge is right. You take the actual budget on the film which is always higher than what they say and the marketing costs and subtract interest and the money that goes to the exhibiters and you need to make a billion to come out OK. You'll never make that streaming or day and date. Now maybe it makes more sense to make eight 30 million dollar movies than gamble on one Dune but if they make a big movie putting it on TV first is fucking dumb. I get the idea of getting $10 a month from 100 million people and being able to rely on that money month after month year after year is an attractive proposition but sabotaging these tent poles in the vain attempt to prop up an underwhelming streaming service is leaving money on the table. Just do what VG suggests and leave it in the theater for a month or 45 days then put it on streaming. You can do both and suck the thing dry.
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