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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Wed August 02, 2017 4:31 pm 
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stip wrote:
Who else thinks Mellon Collie should have been one record?


Could have been an amazing album in that case. It is a little long.


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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Wed August 02, 2017 4:31 pm 
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Did Pete actually pen this OP? I feel like I'm missing something here.


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Wed August 02, 2017 4:35 pm 
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Anders wrote:
stip wrote:
Who else thinks Mellon Collie should have been one record?
Could have been an amazing album in that case. It is a little long.

I like it as a double. It's complex, to say the least, and having so many songs made for years of new discoveries. I think I've listened to it all in one sitting only three or four times but somehow it all still works as a labyrinthian album experience for me any time I listen to either disc.


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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Wed August 02, 2017 9:07 pm 
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Not all of it.


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Wed August 02, 2017 9:08 pm 
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washing machine wrote:
Anders wrote:
stip wrote:
Who else thinks Mellon Collie should have been one record?
Could have been an amazing album in that case. It is a little long.

I like it as a double. It's complex, to say the least, and having so many songs made for years of new discoveries. I think I've listened to it all in one sitting only three or four times but somehow it all still works as a labyrinthian album experience for me any time I listen to either disc.


I can understand that feeling. You are describing the worst and best thing about it (and the white album).


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:30 pm 
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The grunge tourney compelled me to throw together an SP playlist for a long drive yesterday. I think that Billy's ability to convey different characters with his voice is really something special, like Bowie-level good.

Just listen to Bullet With Butterfly Wings: Within the first several bars, he goes from the detached, emotionless "The world is a vampire..." to the hint of bitterness felt in the line "Betrayed desires..." By the time we're at the pre-chorus ("Even though I know..."), the song's character can't really contain the emotion any more; it's starting to seep out in a seething ooze. And then that chorus blasts, and it's all torture and angst.

He uses his voice so effectively across their discography. Unlike Vedder, Cornell, Cobain, Lanegan, and Staley, who all seemed to bring their real-life personality to the microphone, Corgan's songs, and his vocalizations, offer unique characters that bring his songs to life in a completely different way. Add to that the production flourishes and overall sound, and the SPs are more like NIN to me, in that each song brings me into the world of the singer, makes me occupy a different landscape and set of emotions with each track. Dude is brilliant, even if his public persona is silly and annoying.


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:35 pm 
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I agree with you Trag. Corgan was and is one of the very best of his generation...the amount of songs he has and the variety are just astonishing.

I still kinda hate what he is doing with his vocals these days. He always sound so bored and lifeless...such a shame.

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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:41 pm 
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Up through 2000, he was very dynamic and full of raw energy and passion. I think when sp became a revolving door of fill-ins, he lost all of that. Maybe he never should have resurrected sp in 06, despite liking some of Zeitgeist.

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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:43 pm 
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cutuphalfdead wrote:
Any other fans out there? Some drama this morning. I didn't hear the whole story but apparently Amazon released the track listing to the Adore reissue box set coming out prematurely and it was wrong. Upsetting Billy Corgan and rightfully so. Pretty excited for this new reissue of this incredibly underrated/underappreciated album. Here is some info from their website.


Ladies and gentlemen, the ADORE box set has finally arrived! And here at the Nexus we've got the track list. But even better, not only will those interested be able to pre-order copies from MadameZuzus.com (Billy's Highland Park, IL teahouse), but he's informed us that he'll also be signing both box sets and vinyl copies for purchase; with special deals and incentives offered there. So read on, with the accompany press release to ADORE below titles.

From BC: “I spent some time this morning preparing what was meant to be the reveal of the ADORE BOX SET, for where the real juice lies in it is what sonic goodies made their way on it. Notably, I was prepared to share this information here on The Panopticon as far back as two months ago, but made the mistake of asking the record label if I should wait. And if you saw my comments earlier today, you already know that I’m very upset that an online retailer broke their agreement, posting up the tracks up before we could do it here first AS THEY’D ASKED. The irony being where do you think this kind of information comes from, if not for your truly?
Now, let me digress here for a moment. The record business as you already know instinctively is quite bad; and some would say music hasn’t been in such a disadvantageous place in the culture since the selling of commercial music began in the early 1900’s. And I for one have been very outspoken about what I would say are harmful business practices, the kind which place artists in an exploitative position visa vie their rights and ownership of their own work.

Lately though there have been some encouraging signs, particularly in those realms where groups can better own/control/and have some bigger say in how their music is marketed. As an example, The Smashing Pumpkins et al do not own the 90’s albums, although technically it says on a piece of paper that we own 50 pct. But, and this is a big and, I control any use of that music, and having agreed to this reissue campaign a few years back I’ve worked tirelessly to provide, pound-for-pound, the best reissues possible. And believe it or not, in most cases I lose more than I spend on those projects. But this is not to say that I’m not grateful, for I am: to old SP, to our great supporters, and those who’ve taken a new interest in the band because of the depth of our ever-growing catalog.

So in that light you can understand why it boils my blood when ‘ye olde record business stands up and does it same old trample all over what was promised because frankly, they’re more scared of their masters than artists on their rosters. Yes, we are just a small operation over here, and unfortunately on a day that started with so much excitement (the sharing of this info below), now I have to field through excuses to figure out what I can trust going forward. Not because I believe in some corporate logo that helps sell plastic, but because of what I’ve labored to put on that plastic.
SO, let me be the second to present to you the ADORE BOX SET track list, and the first to get it right. Amen…

Disc 1 – Adore: Stereo Remastered
01. To Sheila
02. Ava Adore
03. Perfect
04. Daphne Descends
05. Once Upon a Time
06. Tear
07. Crestfallen
08. Appels + Oranjes
09. Pug
10. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete
11. Annie-Dog
12. Shame
13. Behold! the Night Mare
14. For Martha
15. Blank Page
16. 17

Disc 2 – Adore: Mono Remastered
01. To Sheila
02. Ava Adore
03. Perfect
04. Daphne Descends
05. Once Upon a Time
06. Tear
07. Crestfallen
08. Appels + Oranjes
09. Pug
10. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete
11. Annie-Dog
12. Shame
13. Behold! the Night Mare
14. For Martha
15. Blank Page

Disc 3: In a State of Passage
01. Blissed and Gone (Sadlands Demo)
02. Christmastime (Sadlands Demo)
03. My Mistake (Sadlands Demo)
04. Sparrow (Sadlands Demo)
05. Valentine (Sadlands Demo)
06. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete (Sadlands Demo)
07. What If? (Streeterville Demo)
08. Chewing Gum (CRC Demo)
09. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete (CRC Demo)
10. The Ethers Tragic (Instrumental/ 2014 Mix/ CRC Demo)
11. The Guns of Love Disastrous (Instrumental/ 2014 Mix/ CRC Demo)
12. Annie-Dog (Take 10/ CRC Demo)
13. Once in a While (2014 Mix/ CRC Demo)
14. Do You Close Your Eyes When You Kiss Me? (CRC Demo)
15. For Martha (Take 1/ CRC Demo)
16. My Mistake (Take 1/ CRC Demo)
17. Blissed and Gone (CRC Demo)
18. For Martha (Take 2/ Instrumental/ CRC Demo)

Disc 4: Chalices, Palaces and Deep Pools
01. For Martha (Symphonic Snippet/ Instrumental)
02. Crestfallen (Matt Walker Reimagined/ 2014)
03. To Sheila (Early Banjo Version)
04. Ava Adore (Puffy Combs Remix 1998)
05. O Rio (Instrumental/ Sadlands Demo)
06. Waiting (Adore Outtake)
07. Once Upon a Time (Sadlands Demo)
08. Eye (2014 Mix/ From the ‘Lost Highway’ Soundtrack)
09. Saturnine (For Piano and Voice)
10. Cash Car Star (Matt Walker Reimagined/ 2014)
11. Pug (Matt Walker Reimagined/ 2014)
12. Perfect (No Strings Version)
13. It’s Alright (Instrumental/ Adore Outtake)
14. Czarina (Take 1/ Adore Outtake)
15. Indecision (Sadlands Demo)
16. Blank Page (Early Version)

Disc 5: Malice, Callous and Fools
01. Let Me Give the World to You (Adore Outtake)
02. Tear (From Digital Transfer)
03. Cross (Adore Outtake)
04. Because You Are (Adore B-Side)
05. Jersey Shore (Sadlands Demo)
06. Shame (Take 1)
07. Summer (Instrumental/ Adore Outtake)
08. Blissed and Gone (Drone Version)
09. Heaven (Instrumental/ Sadlands Demo)
10. Daphne Descends (Matt Walker Reimagined/ 2014)
11. Saturnine (Matt Walker Reimagined/ 2014)
12. Behold! the Night Mare (Alternate Vocal)
13. Perfect (Acoustic Demo/ Adore Outtake)
14. Do You Close Your Eyes? (Adore Outtake)
15. The Beginning Is The End Is The Beginning

Disc 6: Kissed Alive Too
01. Ava Adore (Live/ Sao Paulo Session)
02. Daphne Descends (Live/ Sao Paulo Session)
03. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete (Live/ Sao Paulo Session)
04. Tear (Live/ Sao Paulo Session)
05. Shame (Live With Mancow/ Chicago)
06. Blank Page (Live With Mancow/ Chicago)
07. To Sheila (Live/ Nashville/ Ryman Auditorium)
08. Money (That’s What I Want) (Live/ Los Angeles/ Dodger Stadium)
09. X.Y.U. Medley (Live/ Los Angeles/ Dodger Stadium)
10. Transmission (Live/ Chicago/ Rehearsal)

Disc 7 – DVD: Fox Theater, Atlanta, GA – August 4, 1998
01. To Sheila
02. Behold! the Night Mare
03. Pug
04. Crestfallen
05. Ava Adore
06. Tear
07. Annie-Dog
08. Perfect
09. Thru the Eyes of Ruby
10. Tonight, Tonight
11. Once Upon a Time
12. The Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete
13. Bullet with Butterfly Wings
14. Shame
15. For Martha
16. Blank Page
17. Transmission

AND HERE IS THE ACCOMPANYING PRESS RELEASE:

THE SMASHING PUMPKINS’ INTIMATE 1998 MASTERPIECE ‘ADORE’
SET FOR REISSUE ON SEPTEMBER 23
107-track six-CD/DVD package, bundled with rarities, demos and outtakes along with a complete live show from Atlanta’s Fox Theater, will be released in addition to 90-track deluxe digital, double vinyl and single CD versions

Los Angeles, California – July 16, 2014 – When it was first released on June 1, 1998, the Smashing Pumpkins’ Adore, the follow-up to their mega-successful 1995 double album Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness, fans were puzzled by its lack of rock guitars, its folk and electronic elements and relative intimacy. Even the album title, as Billy Corgan mentions in the booklet that accompanies Universal Music Enterprises’ 107-track, six-CD/DVD reissue of the epic disc—due Virgin/UMe on Sept. 23—was misunderstood.

“The funny thing was [it] was a joke that no one ever got,” says Corgan, explaining that Adore was meant as a play on “A Door.” The Smashing Pumpkins’ Adore offered a new entrance to the band’s career, as Corgan experimented with and without the band–whose drummer (and Billy’s musical confidant), Jimmy Chamberlin’s absence played as large a role as his presence might have in the making of the record. The highly personal Corgan songs reflected on the then-recent loss of his mother (“For Martha,” “Once Upon a Time”), his divorce and female issues (“Ava Adore,” “Crestfallen,” “Pug,” “Annie Dog”) and some of the most incisive lyrics he’s ever written (“Blank Pages”).

More than 15 years later, Adore--part of the continuing series of reissues of the iconic alternative band’s acclaimed catalog via Virgin/Ume--stands the test of time or as Rolling Stone writer David Wild calls it in the liner booklet, “the surprisingly beautiful sound of a great band falling apart.” Adore will be released in four different formats; among the previously unreleased tracks is the never-before-available “Blissed and Gone.” Fans may recognize the melody as it can be briefly heard as the final track on the original Adore release.
The Adore Super Deluxe six-CD/DVD package includes 107 tracks, featuring a mono version of the album; “In a State of Passage,” with demos from Corgan’s home Sadlands studio; “Chalices, Palaces, and Deep Pools,” devoted to outtakes, among them an instrumental version of “For Martha,” produced by Flood and Corgan, and “Malice, Callous, and Fools,” featuring an outtake from the Rick Rubin/Corgan collaboration, ”Let Me Give the World to You.” A sixth disc, “Kissed Alive Too,” spotlights live tracks recorded in Nashville’s Ryman Auditorium and L.A.’s Dodger Stadium, among others, while the DVD captures the Smashing Pumpkins in an August 4, 1998 performance at Fox Theater in Atlanta, Georgia. A full booklet with liner notes is also part of the release.
In addition, Adore will be available as a single CD, a double-vinyl version and a deluxe, 90-track digital package.
Capturing a transitional period in the Smashing Pumpkins’ history, Billy Corgan was glad to revisit some of these songs, adding in versions with Bon Harris’ electronic wizardry that proves how the album was way ahead of its time. “I love Adore, but for a while, my opinion of the record was so intertwined with people’s reactions to it at the time. I would say that my kind of iffy feelings lingered long past the point when a lot of fans seemed to come back around to the record–which seemed to really start happening around seven years ago. Now Adore is name-checked by fans constantly.”

Now, thanks to UMe’s four-pronged restoration of this gem, the album can reach a whole new generation of fans, its themes of in Corgan’s words, “disassociation and disintegration and disembodiment” more relevant than ever more than a decade and a half later.--


Has anyone heard this?


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:43 pm 
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Great take, Trag. I've never really paid that much mind to Corgan's vocals, honestly. It's always been about the musicianship and production for me and this band. Occasional vocal standouts aside, I've often thought of Corgan's lyrics and vocals as a necessary means to an end. I'll listen more closely next time.


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 5:45 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
The grunge tourney compelled me to throw together an SP playlist for a long drive yesterday.


Which songs did you include?


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 6:15 pm 
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Anders wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
The grunge tourney compelled me to throw together an SP playlist for a long drive yesterday.


Which songs did you include?

Most of the songs from MC&TIS, about half of Adore, and Eye.


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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 6:19 pm 
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dsb1218 wrote:
96583UP wrote:
of the five threads that bear this name, this one is my favorite


Might as well rank 'em:
1. Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
2. Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
3. Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
4. Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread


You forgot "Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread". Other than that, I think you got the order right. If I had to change anything I might put Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread over Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread. But I feel like that might just be splitting hairs.

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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Sat August 19, 2017 7:05 pm 
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It's a cool name. Better than the generic thread title name.


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 12:36 am 
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Iholdthepain wrote:
Up through 2000, he was very dynamic and full of raw energy and passion. I think when sp became a revolving door of fill-ins, he lost all of that. Maybe he never should have resurrected sp in 06, despite liking some of Zeitgeist.


yeah, he sounds bored and one dimensional in all the albums post Machina...Even the ones that i like. Its weird.

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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 4:52 am 
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Rank your Pumpkins shows...

1. 12-1-1996 Dallas, Reunion Arena

Just got back from seeing PJ close their European tour in Portugal. Jetlagged, we witnessed MCIS -era Pumpkins in full force with Matt Walker on drums. This was angry Billy tearing in to scorching versions of songs. They played forvever, left the stage, the house lights came on, people left, we were leaving, they came back onstage...next thing I k ow, I'm crushed right in front of Billy center stage as they continue to flow through lengthy psychedelic renditions of Aeroplane Flies High and Silverfuck! They play for nearly an hour, just jamming until the music finally fizzled down to nothing. A great bootleg exists of this show... So badass!!!

2. August 1994 Dallas Starplex

This was the year of SP headlining Lollapalooza. I don't remember the events too clearly, as I was tripping on Red Sunshine, however... Already a soul-crushing day as Green Day opened the show. That was fun. I remember really being haunted by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds while somewhat freaking out in the lawn. After George Clinton we decided to go for a walk to the second stage where SP randomly showed up and played a short pre-set. I don't remember which songs, just hundreds of screaming gen-xers running straight towards me. Back on the lawn, as the Beastie Boys hit the stage there was a mass wave of humanity rushing the stage. This scared me pretty badly, but BB brought me back. If was all good! When the Pumpkins came on I was drained, exhausted, and sat still on the lawn as the stage lights began to wash across the night sky. Suddenly, screeching and swirling feedback loops rang from the house pa for what seemed like an eternity... Finally melding together into the chords of Rocket... They were off! Again, I don't remember too many specifics of this particular show, but there's great youtube footage of their Lolla-era shows. I do remember freaking out a bit as Bill stopped down the show to berate us fans. He went on a long rant about being a grown man and he doesn't have to take shit from us. Insane memory!

3. 5-12-2000 Dallas Bronco Bowl

This was the night before my wedding, and we actually danced our first dance 'To Sbiela' so there's sentimental value here. Also, Jimmy was back, Melissa replaced Darcy, and we were treated to a very good Machina-era set. It was a great mood, great sound and sightlines, but it was hot as hell inside the whole night. This tour should have been the end of the Pumpkins.

4. November 1997 Texas Motor Speedway

Here, they were opening for the Rolling Stones and sharing the bill with Matchbox 20 and Dave Matthews Band. Fun lineup and I was into it at the time. It was still daylight when the Pumpkins started, but not for long. This was I think a pre-Adore show, but not long before the album came out. There were early renditions of some of the Adore songs. The hilights for me, though were the Batman and Lost Highway soundtrack songs. It was a much different, mellower, and more electronic sound for the band and I dug it! Needless to say it was a very short set.

5. 2006? Red Rocks

I liked Zeitgeist well enough, and I was all excited that SP got back together (albeit with a different guitarist and another different female bassist). Honestly, I thought the new bass player was hot and I didn't stop watching her the entire time. I also didn't think the sound could ever suck at Red Rocks, but it did on this night. I *think* the show might have been good, but the sound constantly swirled in and out with the winds. We weren't that far away from the soundboard either, and the sound was just bad. For the last song I told my wife I'd meet her at the exit. As they started Cherub Rock to end the sbow, I slilnked my way into the front row, which at RR is at the same level as the band. That was kinda strange, but kinda cool. Sound was better down there, too.

Phew... Your turn.

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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 5:56 am 
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You're from Dallas, thip?


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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 6:14 am 
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washing machine wrote:
You're from Dallas, thip?

born and raised... happy to be 1,000 miles away now.

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 Post subject: Re: generic smashing pumpkins thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 6:23 am 
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Go Astros


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 Post subject: Re: Crucify the Insincere: A Smashing Pumpkins Thread
PostPosted: Sun August 20, 2017 10:30 am 
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"Corgan said earlier this year that he planned to release his new solo album sometime in 2017. The Smashing Pumpkins’ original lineup is rumored to reunite for a tour in 2018."

https://www.alternativenation.net/smashing-pumpkins-billy-corgan-makes-awesome-announcement/


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