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You guys are having a great argument, but Russia was never going to put Wheland on the table. The State Dept has been really clear that it was Griner for Bout or nothing.
shhh. you cant tell people this. their truth is biden and the admin did not do anything to get wheland back
Trading Bout should never have been on the table. It's like releasing El Chapo for a Cancun spring breaker.
This is just some of what he did:
i know the guy was a shitty person. the administration was in a lose-lose situation. if wheland was on the table instead BG the admin would have jumped at the chance to swap and 50% of america would have applauded the move while 50% would have bemoaned the move
If you need to fall back on your intersectional mantras to justify this, that's on you, but this was an unprecedented strategic mistake.
_________________ Did the Mother Fucker pay extra to yell?
An enigma of a man shaped hole in the wall between reality and the soul of the devil.
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:13 pm Posts: 39818 Location: 6000 feet beyond man and time.
Peeps wrote:
B wrote:
You guys are having a great argument, but Russia was never going to put Wheland on the table. The State Dept has been really clear that it was Griner for Bout or nothing.
shhh. you cant tell people this. their truth is biden and the admin did not do anything to get wheland back
If they don't put him on the table, we don't put their guy on the table. Simple as that. We aren't obligated to make a bad trade with them.
“Bad trade”. There you go again assigning different value to different lives.
Also, the Russian was set to get out of prison in 7 years. So using him to get someone out (even though she doesn’t meet your minimum qualifications) seems like a no brainer
i know the guy was a shitty person. the administration was in a lose-lose situation. if wheland was on the table instead BG the admin would have jumped at the chance to swap and 50% of america would have applauded the move while 50% would have bemoaned the move
You're falling back to the false choice. There was the option to not trade, which means no one is better or worse off than before, and that was the right choice here.
BurtReynolds wrote:
So give him another 7 years lol.
And yes, I have no problem assigning different value to different lives because this isn't kindergarten.
This is so obviously the right perspective it hurts to think adults dont get it.
_________________ "The fatal flaw of all revolutionaries is that they know how to tear things down but don't have a f**king clue about how to build anything."
Last edited by Bi_3 on Fri December 09, 2022 1:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
i know the guy was a shitty person. the administration was in a lose-lose situation. if wheland was on the table instead BG the admin would have jumped at the chance to swap and 50% of america would have applauded the move while 50% would have bemoaned the move
You're falling back to the false choice. There was the option to not trade, which means no one is better or worse off than before, and that was the right choice here.
BurtReynolds wrote:
So give him another 7 years lol.
And yes, I have no problem assigning different value to different lives because this isn't kindergarten.
This is so obviously the right perspective it hurts to think adults dont get it.
sorry american citizen because the russian prisoner has 7 years left on his sentence you are going to have to take one for the team and stay there just as long. oh no wait. cause once his sentence is over with his is free to go home and russia can keep you there as long as they like
i am sure if either of you manly men were in BG's place you would tell the state department no dont make the trade i will sacrafice my freedom so that the bad guy stays in jail
_________________ Did the Mother Fucker pay extra to yell?
An enigma of a man shaped hole in the wall between reality and the soul of the devil.
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:13 pm Posts: 39818 Location: 6000 feet beyond man and time.
We should just let all prisoners decide how long they should be in jail. I mean after all, if I were a prisoner I'd want to be set free. Who am I to judge actual prisoners?
i know the guy was a shitty person. the administration was in a lose-lose situation. if wheland was on the table instead BG the admin would have jumped at the chance to swap and 50% of america would have applauded the move while 50% would have bemoaned the move
You're falling back to the false choice. There was the option to not trade, which means no one is better or worse off than before, and that was the right choice here.
BurtReynolds wrote:
So give him another 7 years lol.
And yes, I have no problem assigning different value to different lives because this isn't kindergarten.
This is so obviously the right perspective it hurts to think adults dont get it.
sorry american citizen because the russian prisoner has 7 years left on his sentence you are going to have to take one for the team and stay there just as long. oh no wait. cause once his sentence is over with his is free to go home and russia can keep you there as long as they like
i am sure if either of you manly men were in BG's place you would tell the state department no dont make the trade i will sacrafice my freedom so that the bad guy stays in jail
Per Reuters:
Quote:
"During a spectacular sting operation, Bout was caught on camera agreeing to sell undercover U.S. agents, posing as representatives of Colombia's leftist FARC guerrillas, 100 surface-to-air missiles, which they would use to kill U.S. troops. "
It was up to Biden if he felt the risk is worth the reward. Capitulate to Putin's blackmail agreement in the middle of a war and release one of the worlds great villains setting a dangerous precedent that will risk the lives of Americans everywhere on the planet or leave her there. Seems pretty clear to me.
_________________ "The fatal flaw of all revolutionaries is that they know how to tear things down but don't have a f**king clue about how to build anything."
An enigma of a man shaped hole in the wall between reality and the soul of the devil.
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 5:13 pm Posts: 39818 Location: 6000 feet beyond man and time.
Would you be ok if the US agreed to stop funding Ukraine in exchange for her release? I'm trying to figure out if there is any line where "do anything to get a prisoner released" stops making sense in the real world.
To be fair, we also have no idea of any part of the deal that wasn't publicized. A lot of times there are personnel exchanges in this that never gets declassified. They could have had other American operatives that the public didn't know about, and were released in the trade. The Griner/arms dealer part was just the part we all knew about.
Would you be ok if the US agreed to stop funding Ukraine in exchange for her release? I'm trying to figure out if there is any line where "do anything to get a prisoner released" stops making sense in the real world.
would it be ok if the US agreed to give back the russian if elon agreed to sell twitter for a $1?
you are making up hypotheticals that have no basis in reality and arent worth answering
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