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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu September 06, 2018 1:55 am 
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I appreciate the response and I mostly agree, though I do think people are taking issue more with the way capitalism is managed than they are with markets. Other than health insurance I don’t see any calls for government taking over industry. I do think you hit the nail on the head by stating that many workers cannot keep pace with globalization, and I do believe it is absolutely the job of government to address it. Not in some 20th century socialist manner, but an acknowledgment that, for example, America has an entire region we still call “The Rust Belt” a generation after their industries left. That area was built up by capitalism until it became profitable to leave. There needs to be better management for this process, because it doesn’t seem to me that the public will wait around for a hypothetical worldwide equilibrium. Politics will only get more radical and capitalism more threatened until people feel less economic anxiety (which is what I think makes that racial anxiety really bubble to the surface).


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 3:13 pm 
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Any fans of Modern Monetary Theory?

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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 3:36 pm 
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4/5 wrote:
Any fans of Modern Monetary Theory?

MMT es no bueno, quatro cinco.

Bizarre claims about taxation being merely a mechanism to manage inflation and unemployment by removing money from the economy, of currency issuers not facing any meaningful budget constraints, of a monetary authority having no real effect on output...yada, yada. None of this shows up in the data.

MMT is mostly just gimmicks with accounting identities. It's pretty light on actual economics, and substitutes hand-wavy verbiage for falsifiable models.

Random side note: UMKC is an MMT stronghold (Bernie Sanders' top economic adviser was an MMT advocate and former UMKC prof), and I audited a macro class there back in the day. It was...not great.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 3:41 pm 
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MMT: spending isn't a problem because we can borrow, borrowing isn't a problem because we can print, printing isn't a problem because we can tax, and taxing isn't a problem because we can spend.

It's precisely the kind of logic an old, doddering socialist halfwit would embrace.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 4:50 pm 
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I agree, just wondering if anybody here has found their argument to be more convincing than I have. The entire premise is so counter-intuitive that there's almost a certain charm to it.

A government can literally spend as much as it wants to! Creating money does NOT lead to inflation! A government can provide healthcare and college and universal jobs guarantees without needing to raise taxes or borrow money! Deficits and debts don't matter because a government can always repay anything it owes because it creates money. A government doesn't need to borrow to be able spend. It doesn't need to tax to be able to spend. It can spend because it can create money. And there won't be inflation as long as policymakers match the amount of real goods with the nominal variable, money. If there's no inflation, spend more! If there's inflation, no problem--just raise taxes. Taxes don't finance spending, they control inflation.

It seems to really be taking off in internet circles anyway. And from what I've read, MMTers are increasingly finding themselves in advisory roles to the Sanders crowd of politicians.

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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 5:16 pm 
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I think dkfan9 was into MMT.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Wed October 03, 2018 7:39 pm 
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There was a Planet Money episode a few days ago, so if anybody is interested it offers a more charitable view of it than has been presented here so far.

I guess I'm intrigued by it because it seems to me that it offers an "answer" to the normal economic objections to unfettered government action in healthcare, education, jobs guarantees, etc. I could see a Keynesian vs. MMT battle taking place throughout the Democratic presidential primaries that should be ramping up in about, oh, twelve minutes or so. It might just be another proxy war in the battle between the Left and the Far Left over the soul of the Democratic party, but I'm interested in seeing if MMT gives the Sanders types intellectual cover or not.

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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 06, 2018 6:36 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 7:52 pm 
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Is there a measured take for a “pro” position out there to this Amazon HQ “scandal”? All I’m reading is outrage. There’s got to be more to this, yeah?


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 8:09 pm 
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washing machine wrote:
Is there a measured take for a “pro” position out there to this Amazon HQ “scandal”? All I’m reading is outrage. There’s got to be more to this, yeah?

A business opening up shop is almost unambiguously positive for whichever locale finds itself so blessed by commercial and entrepreneurial fortune. Though I will acknowledge total ignorance as it relates to the specifics of Amazon's tax remuneration package, municipal tax incentives are not corporate welfare.

You will not be surprised to learn that much of this outrage appears misplaced.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 8:12 pm 
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--- wrote:
washing machine wrote:
Is there a measured take for a “pro” position out there to this Amazon HQ “scandal”? All I’m reading is outrage. There’s got to be more to this, yeah?

A business opening up shop is almost unambiguously positive for whichever locale finds itself so blessed by commercial and entrepreneurial fortune. Though I will acknowledge total ignorance as it relates to the specifics of Amazon's tax remuneration package, municipal tax incentives are not corporate welfare.

You will not be surprised to learn that much of this outrage appears misplaced.

More or less what I suspected.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 8:46 pm 
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As I understand, this HQ movement has happened often on the KC section of the Kansas/Missouri border.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 8:51 pm 
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One street in particular - State Line, as fate would have it - sees companies moving from one side to the other often enough, based on nothing more than this particular incentive or that.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 9:01 pm 
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Sounds a lot like the morning drunks traipsing around downtown Texarkana.


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Tue November 13, 2018 10:40 pm 
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Since I didn't know where else to put this:



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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu November 29, 2018 10:12 am 
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how are we not at the top of a stock market and housing bubble?

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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu November 29, 2018 11:18 am 
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BurtReynolds wrote:
how are we not at the top of a stock market and housing bubble?


Who, besides people selling house and securities, says we are not at the top? Because algos made the market jump 2% in one day?

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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu November 29, 2018 12:29 pm 
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bune wrote:
Since I didn't know where else to put this:




Lol Wut?


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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu November 29, 2018 7:02 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Does anyone care about the economy?
PostPosted: Thu November 29, 2018 9:27 pm 
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McParadigm wrote:


These stats do not surprise me at all.

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