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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:20 pm 
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LoathedVermin72 wrote:
It’s about dark jokes becoming an offense worthy of taking away someone’s career.

This exactly. The politics are irrelevant.

Will we as a society make room for offensive and objectionable humor? I certainly hope so.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:20 pm 
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Also, I don’t understand this “make jokes in private” mentality. Is that the world we want? Afraid of being ourselves because the public will weaponize our sense of humor against us? Even though they’re probably doing it themselves in private? Sounds like a goddamn nightmare society to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:21 pm 
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--- wrote:
LoathedVermin72 wrote:
It’s about dark jokes becoming an offense worthy of taking away someone’s career.

This exactly. The politics are irrelevant.

Will we as a society make room for offensive and objectionable humor? I certainly hope so.

Yeah, the idea that anyone who enjoys dark humor should live in fear of having their livelihoods destroyed is insanely fucked up.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:21 pm 
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LoathedVermin72 wrote:
I really wish I weren’t at work because I have sooo much to say. Just keep in mind trag: he made those jokes ten fucking years ago.

Partial mea culpa: I didn't realize it was so long ago, I thought it was more like 2-3 years.

Has he ever issued any sort of apology prior to this thing blowing up in his face?
Or has he done a lot of charity work for those who may have been harmed by his humor?
I genuinely don't know the answer to either.

Most people have to reckon with shitty behavior they made when they were younger and more ignorant. Moral high ground is more readily achieved by facing that reckoning independent of public blowback. I guess that would have some baring on how I ultimately view this.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:22 pm 
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Context and intentions mean everything.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:23 pm 
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LoathedVermin72 wrote:
Also, I don’t understand this “make jokes in private” mentality. Is that the world we want? Afraid of being ourselves because the public will weaponize our sense of humor against us? Even though they’re probably doing it themselves in private? Sounds like a goddamn nightmare society to me.

"Fear" of retribution for humor that targets victims is a small price to pay for having the fortunate position of being the joke-teller rather than the brunt of the joke.

Dark humor, even the victim-targeting kind, has its place in the world. But it doesn't strike me as prudent to go public with that stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:23 pm 
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tree_ wrote:
Context and intentions mean everything.

dude, please don't right now


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:26 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
tree_ wrote:
Context and intentions mean everything.

dude, please don't right now
Do you think Roseanne is really a racist? According to her, she didn't even know the woman was an African American. If this were true, would it change your opinion of what she said?

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:26 pm 
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LoathedVermin72 wrote:
Also, I don’t understand this “make jokes in private” mentality. Is that the world we want? Afraid of being ourselves because the public will weaponize our sense of humor against us? Even though they’re probably doing it themselves in private? Sounds like a goddamn nightmare society to me.

The easiest way to demonstrate the idiocy of this hellscape and the ethos that tends its grounds is to let these self-appointed cultural gendarmes cannibalize each other when they fail to live up to their own standards.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:27 pm 
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lol "Guys my brother was a regular shithead but then he got insanely successful and so he stopped being a shithead so let's just give him a pass, huh?"

https://www.nme.com/news/film/james-gun ... on-2358276


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:29 pm 
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tree_ wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
tree_ wrote:
Context and intentions mean everything.

dude, please don't right now
Do you think Roseanne is really a racist? According to her, she didn't even know the woman was an African American. If this were true, would it change your opinion of what she said?

I've never met Roseanne so I have no idea if she's a real racist. I think she's very talented, and made a vile comment, and lost her great TV show over it. Sucks for her but her millions of dollars will probably still keep her very happy at night.


Last edited by tragabigzanda on Mon July 23, 2018 7:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:29 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
LoathedVermin72 wrote:
I really wish I weren’t at work because I have sooo much to say. Just keep in mind trag: he made those jokes ten fucking years ago.

Partial mea culpa: I didn't realize it was so long ago, I thought it was more like 2-3 years.

Has he ever issued any sort of apology prior to this thing blowing up in his face?
Or has he done a lot of charity work for those who may have been harmed by his humor?
I genuinely don't know the answer to either.

Most people have to reckon with shitty behavior they made when they were younger and more ignorant. Moral high ground is more readily achieved by facing that reckoning independent of public blowback. I guess that would have some baring on how I ultimately view this.

Yes, he apologized for all this years ago.

You should look into the specifics of this a bit closer. Specially about how it was fueled by pro-rape piece of shit Mike Cernovich. This was never about any kind of moral or principle.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:31 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
tree_ wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
tree_ wrote:
Context and intentions mean everything.

dude, please don't right now
Do you think Roseanne is really a racist? According to her, she didn't even know the woman was an African American. If this were true, would it change your opinion of what she said?

I've never met Roseanne so I have no idea if she's a real racist. I think she's very talented, and made a vile comment, and lost her great TV show over it. Sucks for her but her millions of dollars will probably still keep her very happy at night.
Would her comment have been vile if she didn't know the woman was black?

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:32 pm 
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LoathedVermin72 wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
LoathedVermin72 wrote:
I really wish I weren’t at work because I have sooo much to say. Just keep in mind trag: he made those jokes ten fucking years ago.

Partial mea culpa: I didn't realize it was so long ago, I thought it was more like 2-3 years.

Has he ever issued any sort of apology prior to this thing blowing up in his face?
Or has he done a lot of charity work for those who may have been harmed by his humor?
I genuinely don't know the answer to either.

Most people have to reckon with shitty behavior they made when they were younger and more ignorant. Moral high ground is more readily achieved by facing that reckoning independent of public blowback. I guess that would have some baring on how I ultimately view this.

Yes, he apologized for all this years ago.

You should look into the specifics of this a bit closer. Specially about how it was fueled by pro-rape piece of shit Mike Cernovich. This was never about any kind of moral or principle.


Well if he apologized publicly a long time ago, of his own volition, then yeah, that sucks.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:36 pm 
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trag, I think your weird prejudice against rich showbiz people is really clouding your judgment here. To the point where you’re dismissing wider implications and appearing callous.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:39 pm 
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How so? He made jokes at the expense of victims, people who are lacking power and a voice. His station in life as one of the wealthy elite makes it distasteful to me that he would joke at their expense. I don't think he should go to jail, nor should he lose his fortune. I just don't care if he never makes another superhero movie ever again. I hope those who were made to feel even more small and powerless by his humor and station feel a little emboldened by his public shaming.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:40 pm 
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How were they at the expense of victims? Seems very debatable.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:47 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
How so? He made jokes at the expense of victims, people who are lacking power and a voice. His station in life as one of the wealthy elite makes it distasteful to me that he would joke at their expense. I don't think he should go to jail, nor should he lose his fortune. I just don't care if he never makes another superhero movie ever again. I hope those who were made to feel even more small and powerless by his humor and station feel a little emboldened by his public shaming.

Ah yes, "victims" and the offended are owed their pound of flesh, having endured a harrowing gauntlet of coarse jest.


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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 7:51 pm 
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tragabigzanda wrote:
lol "Guys my brother was a regular shithead but then he got insanely successful and so he stopped being a shithead so let's just give him a pass, huh?"

https://www.nme.com/news/film/james-gun ... on-2358276
Yeah... if he's no longer a shit head who makes dumb jokes and he actually got his life together and is now a stand up guy, why wouldn't you celebrate this? Punishing someone for who they used to be seems counterproductive to me. Unless you believe his soul is permanently dark and vile and he does nothing but dream of raping boys.

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 Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
PostPosted: Mon July 23, 2018 8:05 pm 
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tree_ wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
lol "Guys my brother was a regular shithead but then he got insanely successful and so he stopped being a shithead so let's just give him a pass, huh?"

https://www.nme.com/news/film/james-gun ... on-2358276
Yeah... if he's no longer a shit head who makes dumb jokes and he actually got his life together and is now a stand up guy, why wouldn't you celebrate this? Punishing someone for who they used to be seems counterproductive to me. Unless you believe his soul is permanently dark and vile and he does nothing but dream of raping boys.

Oh no.....I agree with tree!

I actually found his brother’s tweets pretty moving, specifically how he gave some insight into the personal themes of the movies.

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