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Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 5:59 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 47166 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
tragabigzanda wrote:
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
You just wanted to use the term "straw men" to sound smart.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:00 pm
Guys, I am not a moderator! I swear to God! Why does everyone think I'm a moderator?
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 2:48 pm Posts: 47353
tragabigzanda wrote:
I'm reminded of the Louie episode where he takes his daughters to see their great-grandmother, and she uses the N-word repeatedly. His daughters are offended and think she needs to be called out; Louie explains she's very old, confused, and she comes from another time. Consider me on Team Louie on this one.
You mean the show featuring Louis C.K.?
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Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:00 pm
Looks Like a Cat
Joined: Wed April 20, 2016 7:11 pm Posts: 14268
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
So, I’m gonna get the terminology wrong here, but it’s “proximal” (??) reporting that is tying them together. The HW thing is part of the #metoo trend so most of the articles online covering him include both the description of what he is accused of and what Weinstein is accused of. By having both in the same article, you can imply to the reader they are the same thing. Fox News did this with Obama and Islam quite regularly.
_________________ "The fatal flaw of all revolutionaries is that they know how to tear things down but don't have a f**king clue about how to build anything."
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:01 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 47166 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
E.H. Ruddock wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
I'm reminded of the Louie episode where he takes his daughters to see their great-grandmother, and she uses the N-word repeatedly. His daughters are offended and think she needs to be called out; Louie explains she's very old, confused, and she comes from another time. Consider me on Team Louie on this one.
You mean the show featuring Louis C.K.?
I'm not ready to admit that he might be a creep. If the evidence ever becomes damning, I'll stop paying attention to the guy's art. But he's not in the Woody Allen/Roman Polanski league yet; there's still a fair amount of doubt in my mind.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:02 pm
Guys, I am not a moderator! I swear to God! Why does everyone think I'm a moderator?
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 2:48 pm Posts: 47353
tragabigzanda wrote:
E.H. Ruddock wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
I'm reminded of the Louie episode where he takes his daughters to see their great-grandmother, and she uses the N-word repeatedly. His daughters are offended and think she needs to be called out; Louie explains she's very old, confused, and she comes from another time. Consider me on Team Louie on this one.
You mean the show featuring Louis C.K.?
I'm not ready to admit that he might be a creep. If the evidence ever becomes damning, I'll stop paying attention to the guy's art. But he's not in the Woody Allen/Roman Polanski league yet; there's still a fair amount of doubt in my mind.
I'm not saying you should, but given the topic you are arguing in this thread, you might have picked a better example.
_________________ Clouuuuds Rolll byyy...BANG BANG BANG BANG
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:03 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 47166 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
Bi_3 wrote:
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
So, I’m gonna get the terminology wrong here, but it’s “proximal” (??) reporting that is tying them together. The HW thing is part of the #metoo trend so most of the articles online covering him include both the description of what he is accused of and what Weinstein is accused of. By having both in the same article, you can imply to the reader they are the same thing. Fox News did this with Obama and Islam quite regularly.
Exactly. It's super irresponsible reporting, and overly sensationalizes something to the detriment of the quality of the conversation.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:07 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 47166 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
E.H. Ruddock wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
E.H. Ruddock wrote:
tragabigzanda wrote:
I'm reminded of the Louie episode where he takes his daughters to see their great-grandmother, and she uses the N-word repeatedly. His daughters are offended and think she needs to be called out; Louie explains she's very old, confused, and she comes from another time. Consider me on Team Louie on this one.
You mean the show featuring Louis C.K.?
I'm not ready to admit that he might be a creep. If the evidence ever becomes damning, I'll stop paying attention to the guy's art. But he's not in the Woody Allen/Roman Polanski league yet; there's still a fair amount of doubt in my mind.
I'm not saying you should, but given the topic you are arguing in this thread, you might have picked a better example.
Yeah, I considered it but I've gotten quite good at punching my own internal filter right in the nuts.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:08 pm
Poster of the Year
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 2:04 pm Posts: 37156 Location: September 2020 Poster of the Month
Yeah, equating acts that are different degrees of sexual assault is the same as calling the first black President a secret Muslim bent on destroying America.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:13 pm
Rank This Poster
Joined: Thu January 03, 2013 1:10 am Posts: 3879
Bi_3 wrote:
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
So, I’m gonna get the terminology wrong here, but it’s “proximal” (??) reporting that is tying them together. The HW thing is part of the #metoo trend so most of the articles online covering him include both the description of what he is accused of and what Weinstein is accused of. By having both in the same article, you can imply to the reader they are the same thing. Fox News did this with Obama and Islam quite regularly.
I think an article detailing the situation concerning HW Bush, including how and why the accuser came to speak out publicly that did not mention the Weinstein issue would be nonsensical.
Last edited by digster on Thu October 26, 2017 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:14 pm
Looks Like a Cat
Joined: Wed April 20, 2016 7:11 pm Posts: 14268
cutuphalfdead wrote:
Yeah, equating acts that are different degrees of sexual assault is the same as calling the first black President a secret Muslim bent on destroying America.
Don't be an ass. We were clearly talking about the effects of that type of information presentation, not the inputs.
_________________ "The fatal flaw of all revolutionaries is that they know how to tear things down but don't have a f**king clue about how to build anything."
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:17 pm
Poster of the Year
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 2:04 pm Posts: 37156 Location: September 2020 Poster of the Month
Bi_3 wrote:
cutuphalfdead wrote:
Yeah, equating acts that are different degrees of sexual assault is the same as calling the first black President a secret Muslim bent on destroying America.
Don't be an ass. We were clearly talking about the effects of that type of information presentation, not the inputs.
Yet you presented an issue that involves two related things next to a batshit crazy conspiracy theory.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:19 pm
Looks Like a Cat
Joined: Wed April 20, 2016 7:11 pm Posts: 14268
digster wrote:
Bi_3 wrote:
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
So, I’m gonna get the terminology wrong here, but it’s “proximal” (??) reporting that is tying them together. The HW thing is part of the #metoo trend so most of the articles online covering him include both the description of what he is accused of and what Weinstein is accused of. By having both in the same article, you can imply to the reader they are the same thing. Fox News did this with Obama and Islam quite regularly.
I think an article detailing the situation concerning HW Bush, including how and why the accuser came to speak out publicly that did not mention the Weinstein issue would be nonsensical.
A writer could easily mention the hashtag empowering silenced women to speak up without detailing or even mentioning what Weinstein is accused of.
_________________ "The fatal flaw of all revolutionaries is that they know how to tear things down but don't have a f**king clue about how to build anything."
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:24 pm
Rank This Poster
Joined: Thu January 03, 2013 1:10 am Posts: 3879
Again, I don't think that would make any sense. The reason the #metoo campaign is in the news is because of the increased attention the Weinstein issue brought to bear on sexual abuse and harassment. You're asking they exclude certain information from a story because of a hypothetical scenario where someone might conflate the two accusations, even if the dual accusations (including the differences) are articulated in the article. That's not really a good reason to ignore pertinent information.
Last edited by digster on Thu October 26, 2017 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 6:24 pm
Polluted
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 10:27 am Posts: 4202 Location: PM me, I have everything.
Bi_3 wrote:
digster wrote:
Bi_3 wrote:
digster wrote:
You're setting up straw men that don't exist; besides the fact that Weinstein has brought this further into the public eye, who is saying that President H.W. Bush and Weinstein are one in the same. Additionally, I'm not under the impression that the elder Bush was suffering from dementia, and speaking as someone who's had considerable experience with folks suffering from dementia/late stage Alzheimer's, I've never seen a situation where it turns someone into a serial groper. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but your assertion that "this is just what the elderly do" is off-base.
No one's sending HW Bush to jail, so I don't know where that's coming from. I guess I don't really see how you could argue that publicity on this that makes it clear how not okay this is could possibly be a bad thing.
So, I’m gonna get the terminology wrong here, but it’s “proximal” (??) reporting that is tying them together. The HW thing is part of the #metoo trend so most of the articles online covering him include both the description of what he is accused of and what Weinstein is accused of. By having both in the same article, you can imply to the reader they are the same thing. Fox News did this with Obama and Islam quite regularly.
I think an article detailing the situation concerning HW Bush, including how and why the accuser came to speak out publicly that did not mention the Weinstein issue would be nonsensical.
A writer could easily mention the hashtag empowering silenced women to speak up without detailing or even mentioning what Weinstein is accused of.
That hashtag was born out of what Weinstein is accused of, though.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 10:14 pm
I Have A Third Nipple
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 7:41 am Posts: 19724 Location: Cumberland, RI
I can only speak for myself, but what's troubling about the HW stories is that it seems pretty clear that people around him knew what was going on. The first woman to speak out talked to one of his security guards about it and was not told, "Oh, I'm sorry, he's losing it a bit...why don't we talk to [insert name of someone who represents HW] and we'll clear this up? We're sorry this happened, we want to make it right." She was told that she shouldn't have stood next to him. That's pretty messed up.
Post subject: Re: Bill Cosby's Pudding Pop & Other Sexual Assault Stuff
Posted: Thu October 26, 2017 10:19 pm
Production Police
Joined: Tue September 24, 2013 5:56 pm Posts: 47166 Location: In the oatmeal aisle wearing a Shellac shirt
But so what? I knew that my grandfather had a tendency to shit himself, but I did not ever make a public announcement about it or tell people to stay away from him, because it just made him look more sad than he already was.
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