Red Mosquito :: View topic

Mickey wrote:

Peeps wrote:

warren, harris and a very distant third is sanders

Explain this logic to me. Sanders and Warren have very similar politics. Why does Harris come between them?

sanders is just too old. i realize hes not even 10 years older than warren(he'll be almost 80 at the time of election) but we do need someone a bit younger. the others im not impressed with at all even though they are younger so i am wagering age vs what i like about what i am hearing

Mickey wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

Mickey wrote:

Sanders and Warren have very similar politics.

There are some huge differences in how their ideas would play out though.

Warren's highly detailed policies -- which mostly amount to "tax the super-rich, and impose modest taxes on those making between $100K-$250K." She has clear delineations of taxes/support for those beneath the poverty line, in the middle class, in the $100K-$250K bracket, $250K+, and then the "super rich" (not sure exactly where this starts). Her vision equates to a check on the capitalist/globalist system that has prospered on the back of everyone else since forever...

Bernie's policies, on the other hand, have typically been long on concept and short on details; and with the notable exception of his educational plan, are very much an off-shoot of socialism. Without much info, I see his ideas, in the long run, devolving into the Gov't-subsidized affluenza that Bi_3 mentioned the other day.

It'll be fun to watch the two of them debate.

I don't agree with your details here

How so?

As things are evolving, I am less scared of Warren than I once was. I feel like she has the Obama vibe to her where she says dumb prog shit on the campaign trail but is smart enough not to try and enact any of it.

tragabigzanda wrote:

Mickey wrote:

tragabigzanda wrote:

Mickey wrote:

Sanders and Warren have very similar politics.

I don't agree with your details here

How so?

I think you're using "affluenza" in a way that doesn't make any sense and glosses over the complicated history of socdem states--and I extrapolate that to think that your read of the impact of Sanders' policies is skewed. I also wouldn't use globalist to describe capitalist, given the redundancy and the fact that that's an alt-right term. But again, the main point I agree with entirely: Warren wants an ethical capitalism and Sanders wants a very light form of a centralized democratic state socialism.

plus C. Thomas Howell is the original Rachel Dolezal

bart wrote:

plus C. Thomas Howell is the original Rachel Dolezal

This deserved some appreciation gang, WTF?

Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist?

Rob wrote:

Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist?

I think the inverse is true too. I become more convinced every day that the socialist left refuses to accept Warren as anything close to an equal to Sanders simply on the grounds that she calls herself a capitalist and he calls himself a socialist.

That ranking thing didn't catch on like I'd hoped.

Green Habit wrote:

Rob wrote:

Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist?

I agree completely. The anti-capitalist left is where I draw the line, personally. I don't think either of these candidates are anti one system or the other. It's about balance. Maybe I'm wrong, but I've just always seen these two as slightly different paths to the same place. They've both been doing this a long time, they're both authentic, and basically arguing the same thing from different approaches.

I Side With 2020 edition if anybody's bored.

Author:	Jammer XCI [ Wed June 26, 2019 1:22 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Warren Sanders Beto, but only because he was in a band with Cedric Bixler Zavala of At the Drive In Vermin Supreme

Author:	Simple Torture [ Wed June 26, 2019 2:53 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Fuck: Gabbard Marry: Beto Kill: Sestak

Author:	Mickey [ Wed June 26, 2019 3:23 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Peeps wrote: Mickey wrote: Peeps wrote: warren, harris and a very distant third is sanders Explain this logic to me. Sanders and Warren have very similar politics. Why does Harris come between them? sanders is just too old. i realize hes not even 10 years older than warren(he'll be almost 80 at the time of election) but we do need someone a bit younger. the others im not impressed with at all even though they are younger so i am wagering age vs what i like about what i am hearing That makes sense. Oldest president ever is not a great look, especially in this election.

Author:	Mickey [ Wed June 26, 2019 3:24 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Fuck: Beto Marry: Tulsi Kill: Hard choice but I gotta go with Delaney

Author:	Mickey [ Wed June 26, 2019 3:28 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
tragabigzanda wrote: Mickey wrote: tragabigzanda wrote: Mickey wrote: Sanders and Warren have very similar politics. There are some huge differences in how their ideas would play out though. Warren's highly detailed policies -- which mostly amount to "tax the super-rich, and impose modest taxes on those making between $100K-$250K." She has clear delineations of taxes/support for those beneath the poverty line, in the middle class, in the $100K-$250K bracket, $250K+, and then the "super rich" (not sure exactly where this starts). Her vision equates to a check on the capitalist/globalist system that has prospered on the back of everyone else since forever... Bernie's policies, on the other hand, have typically been long on concept and short on details; and with the notable exception of his educational plan, are very much an off-shoot of socialism. Without much info, I see his ideas, in the long run, devolving into the Gov't-subsidized affluenza that Bi_3 mentioned the other day. It'll be fun to watch the two of them debate. I don't agree with your details here How so? I think you're using "affluenza" in a way that doesn't make any sense and glosses over the complicated history of socdem states--and I extrapolate that to think that your read of the impact of Sanders' policies is skewed. I also wouldn't use globalist to describe capitalist, given the redundancy and the fact that that's an alt-right term. But again, the main point I agree with entirely: Warren wants an ethical capitalism and Sanders wants a very light form of a centralized democratic state socialism.

Red Mosquito http://forums.theskyiscrape.com/

Election 2020 http://forums.theskyiscrape.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10072	Page 3 of 555

Author:	Mickey [ Wed June 26, 2019 3:30 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Bi_3 wrote: As things are evolving, I am less scared of Warren than I once was. I feel like she has the Obama vibe to her where she says dumb prog shit on the campaign trail but is smart enough not to try and enact any of it. Yeah man the great thing about Obama was how he reneged on all his campaign promises, which is why his presidency was so successful and didn't at all inspire deep resentment in certain pockets of the polity.

Author:	tragabigzanda [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:00 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Mickey wrote: tragabigzanda wrote: Mickey wrote: tragabigzanda wrote: Mickey wrote: Sanders and Warren have very similar politics. There are some huge differences in how their ideas would play out though. Warren's highly detailed policies -- which mostly amount to "tax the super-rich, and impose modest taxes on those making between $100K-$250K." She has clear delineations of taxes/support for those beneath the poverty line, in the middle class, in the $100K-$250K bracket, $250K+, and then the "super rich" (not sure exactly where this starts). Her vision equates to a check on the capitalist/globalist system that has prospered on the back of everyone else since forever... Bernie's policies, on the other hand, have typically been long on concept and short on details; and with the notable exception of his educational plan, are very much an off-shoot of socialism. Without much info, I see his ideas, in the long run, devolving into the Gov't-subsidized affluenza that Bi_3 mentioned the other day. It'll be fun to watch the two of them debate. I don't agree with your details here How so? I think you're using "affluenza" in a way that doesn't make any sense and glosses over the complicated history of socdem states--and I extrapolate that to think that your read of the impact of Sanders' policies is skewed. I also wouldn't use globalist to describe capitalist, given the redundancy and the fact that that's an alt-right term. But again, the main point I agree with entirely: Warren wants an ethical capitalism and Sanders wants a very light form of a centralized democratic state socialism. I’m not reading too deeply into Bi_3’s usage of “affluenza” other than to say I appreciate the sentiment; your understanding of the term seems way more intellectual than my own. I don’t think I’m misreading Bernie at all, but don’t feel like typing out a long response on my phone. My lumping together of the capitalist/globalist terms should only be read casually; obviously there are similarities and differences between the two, and potential redundancy is certainly fair, but I was merely trying to speak to both the “America First” capitalists (who are basically uninformed globalists) and the more “woke” globalists. I’m glad you ultimately did get my main point, and you in fact state it more succinctly and eloquently than I did, so thanks for that.

Author:	Superblood Wolfmoon [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:11 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
bart wrote: plus C. Thomas Howell is the original Rachel Dolezal This deserved some appreciation gang, WTF?

Author:	LoathedVermin72 [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:12 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Soul Man

Author:	Rob [ Wed June 26, 2019 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Bernie & Warren have obvious stylistic differences, and have crafted their messages in a different way, but I will never understand why people try so hard to deny that they are in a distinct & similar league of their own. They both spend their time identifying Wall St as corrupt, and both advocate strongly for redistribution of wealth in order to vastly expand the welfare state in ways that would have branded them "far left radicals" just a few years ago (which is what either of them will be referred to as in a general election regardless). Warren actually wants to put employees (or at least employee representation) on the boards of corporations - something the far left has wanted forever. That is as far left a move as any. She is as much a 1% vs 99% candidate as Bernie. Maybe Bernie is too old. Maybe his temperament is bad for the job (that would be my biggest concern). There's plenty of reasons to not like one or the other. But their agendas aren't different in general and I don't see how one is further left than the other. Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist? Both spend all day attacking the capitalists themselves, and neither is advocating for government takeover of industry aside from private health insurance (which is common in capitalist countries). If at the end of the day we get President Warren because "Bernie was too much," you're gonna have a hard time wiping the smirks off the faces of the left. Just my $.02

Author:	Green Habit [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Rob wrote: Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist? I think the inverse is true too. I become more convinced every day that the socialist left refuses to accept Warren as anything close to an equal to Sanders simply on the grounds that she calls herself a capitalist and he calls himself a socialist.

Author:	Rob [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Green Habit wrote: Rob wrote: Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist? I think the inverse is true too. I become more convinced every day that the socialist left refuses to accept Warren as anything close to an equal to Sanders simply on the grounds that she calls herself a capitalist and he calls himself a socialist. I agree completely. The anti-capitalist left is where I draw the line, personally. I don't think either of these candidates are anti one system or the other. It's about balance. Maybe I'm wrong, but I've just always seen these two as slightly different paths to the same place. They've both been doing this a long time, they're both authentic, and basically arguing the same thing from different approaches.

Author:	B [ Wed June 26, 2019 4:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
That ranking thing didn't catch on like I'd hoped.

Author:	Green Habit [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:20 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
B wrote: That ranking thing didn't catch on like I'd hoped. It was a good idea. I think the problem is that we know that at least half of these candidates shouldn't even be running.

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Author:	4/5 [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
I Side With 2020 edition if anybody's bored.

Author:	Green Habit [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:24 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Rank the 2020 Democratic Candidates
Rob wrote: Green Habit wrote: Rob wrote: Is she ok because she calls herself a capitalist while he's bad for using the term socialist? I think the inverse is true too. I become more convinced every day that the socialist left refuses to accept Warren as anything close to an equal to Sanders simply on the grounds that she calls herself a capitalist and he calls himself a socialist. I agree completely. The anti-capitalist left is where I draw the line, personally. I don't think either of these candidates are anti one system or the other. It's about balance. Maybe I'm wrong, but I've just always seen these two as slightly different paths to the same place. They've both been doing this a long time, they're both authentic, and basically arguing the same thing from different approaches. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a spot somewhere in Bernie's mind that wants to seize the means of production. But if so, his actions show that that's not going to happen in his lifetime, and he's not letting perfect be the enemy of what he sees as good, something that a lot of socialist left struggles with.

Author:	Peeps [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
4/5 wrote: I Side With 2020 edition if anybody's bored. great, i got charizard

Author:	Simple Torture [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
4/5 wrote: I Side With 2020 edition if anybody's bored. Shit! I got Trump. Spoiler: show Actually, Gillibrand.

Author:	Green Habit [ Wed June 26, 2019 5:59 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Election 2020
4/5 wrote: I Side With 2020 edition if anybody's bored. Beto 80%, Delaney 66%, Biden 64%, Kasich 44%, Trump 34%. All the other Dems and Johnson in the 70s.