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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 4:21 pm 
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Future Drummer
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Strat wrote:
Come to GOAT with me. Its a bunch of ex crossfitters who realized how awful cross fit is. Similar lifts (squats, deadlifts, overhead press, chest press, circuit and interval training and various other strength training options)

I feel so good these days.

215 on my working weight for dead lifts. It makes me happy.

Also, lets do yoga.

What were their objections to Crossfit?

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 4:26 pm 
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The Master
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4/5 wrote:
Strat wrote:
Come to GOAT with me. Its a bunch of ex crossfitters who realized how awful cross fit is. Similar lifts (squats, deadlifts, overhead press, chest press, circuit and interval training and various other strength training options)

I feel so good these days.

215 on my working weight for dead lifts. It makes me happy.

Also, lets do yoga.

What were their objections to Crossfit?

Sustainability, form, functional movement.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 4:48 pm 
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Future Drummer
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Strat wrote:
--- wrote:
4/5 wrote:
--- wrote:
Self wrote:
Body types matter, you guys.

what would your ideal program look like for a taut 6' 173lb marketmonging fop who's interested in balancing gaining a moderate amount of strength, increasing overall functional athletic capacity, and staying quite lean?

crossfit is not an option

If you want to get stronger Crossfit is obviously not an option.

It depends on where you're starting from, but my advice is really simple:
For strength, follow a program centered on compound, heavy lifts. For athletic capacity, do some plyometric type of training and conditioning work. Assuming you're currently eating a maintenance level of calories, bump that up by 10% as you'll need those calories for the additional work you'll be doing. Provided that you're not eating pure junk, any weight you'll be putting on should overwhelmingly be muscle.

There are a ton of good strength programs out there, and while some may be better or worse than others it really just comes down to consistency. So pick one that you believe in and do it consistently.

Strength training 3 days a week: squats, deadlifts, bench, overhead press, chins, and cleans might be a good place to start. Google starting strength or Bill Starr for specific programs based around these exercises. You'll probably start by doing 3-5 sets of 5 reps progressively adding more weight each workout as long as you can.

Then 2-3x a week you can do your preferred conditioning/athletic activities: swimming, sprinting, circuit training, cycling, etc.

okay i'm on the right track then, this sounds pretty much like my program now. lift three times a week, focusing on compound movements and form (i'm less concerned with progressive overload than most, i suspect; i add weight only after i can do at least three sets of ten reps maintaining ideal form) and then swim two or three times a week, alternating between low/medium-intensity steady state and sprints. i limit myself to one cheat meal a week, hit the vegetables and lean proteins pretty dang hard, and have almost entirely eliminated processed junk (simple carbs and added sugars). my goal is to solicit a request from the lennytheweedwhacker account to rub my abs and/or lats.



Come to GOAT with me. Its a bunch of ex crossfitters who realized how awful cross fit is. Similar lifts (squats, deadlifts, overhead press, chest press, circuit and interval training and various other strength training options)

I feel so good these days.

215 on my working weight for dead lifts. It makes me happy.

Also, lets do yoga.

what is GOAT? not sure i could handle yoga

my absolute favorite tool in the gym is the landmine attachment/apparatus. the landmine chest press has been better for my chest development than any other lift. it's such a simple and versatile tool, too. i use it to work the back (rows), core (180s) and legs (bulgarian split squats). if your gym has one you should definitely use it.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:04 pm 
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Future Drummer
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Strat wrote:
4/5 wrote:
What were their objections to Crossfit?

Sustainability, form, functional movement.

Can you elaborate? I'm just curious. I enjoy mocking CF as much as the next guy, but I'm interested in the perspective of former adherents to the faith.

By sustainability and form, I'm assuming you mean the injury-prone nature of the endeavor/you'll burn out quickly so it's not something to do for the long haul? And they didn't like the functional movement nature of CF?

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:08 pm 
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The Master
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4/5 wrote:
Strat wrote:
4/5 wrote:
What were their objections to Crossfit?

Sustainability, form, functional movement.

Can you elaborate? I'm just curious. I enjoy mocking CF as much as the next guy, but I'm interested in the perspective of former adherents to the faith.

By sustainability and form, I'm assuming you mean the injury-prone nature of the endeavor/you'll burn out quickly so it's not something to do for the long haul? And they didn't like the functional movement nature of CF?

For me personally, as a yoga instructor and what little I know of body mechanics, when i watch cross fitters do mostly anything - especially "pullups" i can't help but cringe then laugh. Is that really building strength if you are just using momentum to swing yourself up?

Similar to a lot of their lifts as well.

the place i go to, i feel, they are very strict on rest in between sets and not working towards and at your absolute max. If you are too sore to hike the next day, then you lifted too much. They want this strength training to really benefit that which we do outside of the gym, not detract.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:27 pm 
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Strat wrote:
For me personally, as a yoga instructor and what little I know of body mechanics, when i watch cross fitters do mostly anything - especially "pullups" i can't help but cringe then laugh. Is that really building strength if you are just using momentum to swing yourself up?

Similar to a lot of their lifts as well.

the place i go to, i feel, they are very strict on rest in between sets and not working towards and at your absolute max. If you are too sore to hike the next day, then you lifted too much. They want this strength training to really benefit that which we do outside of the gym, not detract.

Makes sense to train like that based on that goal I suppose. Obviously that's pretty different than you would train if your goal was purely strength.

Crossfit pullups are the worst thing ever and I think there's a lot of foolishness about the way they program, but I don't think there's any doubt that if a person did it for a little while that they'd be pretty fit.

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:32 pm 
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The Master
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4/5 wrote:
Strat wrote:
For me personally, as a yoga instructor and what little I know of body mechanics, when i watch cross fitters do mostly anything - especially "pullups" i can't help but cringe then laugh. Is that really building strength if you are just using momentum to swing yourself up?

Similar to a lot of their lifts as well.

the place i go to, i feel, they are very strict on rest in between sets and not working towards and at your absolute max. If you are too sore to hike the next day, then you lifted too much. They want this strength training to really benefit that which we do outside of the gym, not detract.

Makes sense to train like that based on that goal I suppose. Obviously that's pretty different than you would train if your goal was purely strength.

Crossfit pullups are the worst thing ever and I think there's a lot of foolishness about the way they program, but I don't think there's any doubt that if a person did it for a little while that they'd be pretty fit.

No question. And i know plenty of crossfitters who could kick the ever loving shit out of me. I also know a lot with serious injuries and chronic pain.

its all balance.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:36 pm 
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--- wrote:
okay i'm on the right track then, this sounds pretty much like my program now. lift three times a week, focusing on compound movements and form (i'm less concerned with progressive overload than most, i suspect; i add weight only after i can do at least three sets of ten reps maintaining ideal form) and then swim two or three times a week, alternating between low/medium-intensity steady state and sprints. i limit myself to one cheat meal a week, hit the vegetables and lean proteins pretty dang hard, and have almost entirely eliminated processed junk (simple carbs and added sugars). my goal is to solicit a request from the lennytheweedwhacker account to rub my abs and/or lats.

Adding sets or reps is also progressive overload. If you can do 3x8 now and two weeks ago you could only do 3x5, that's still progress. I program bench and OHP pretty much the way you do. Personally, I think squats and deads really benefit from low rep schemes. I very rarely squat more than 8 reps and for a long time I rarely did more than 5 reps in any given set. Squats above 5 reps feel like a marathon cardio session so I think for me it'd really hold me back from making progress to hit reps that high consistently. But my focus has typically been maximal strength, so there's that.

Also I quoted this just in case Lenny missed your hopes and dreams at the bottom of the previous page.

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:39 pm 
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Strat wrote:
crossfitters who could kick the ever loving shit out of me. I also know a lot with serious injuries and chronic pain.

its all balance.

For sure. That's something Crossfit is lacking completely.

Also, you sound like my wife. "It's about balance" is her go-to phrase regarding training and diet. Which is probably good because I'm likely to go careening towards an extreme in pursuit of my goal of the moment.

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:43 pm 
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The Master
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4/5 wrote:
Strat wrote:
crossfitters who could kick the ever loving shit out of me. I also know a lot with serious injuries and chronic pain.

its all balance.

For sure. That's something Crossfit is lacking completely.

Also, you sound like my wife. "It's about balance" is her go-to phrase regarding training and diet. Which is probably good because I'm likely to go careening towards an extreme in pursuit of my goal of the moment.


Its the yogi in me. I used to be like you but noticed I was wearing out and losing enjoyment of working out and the process. My girlfriend has her masters degree in aruyveda and its all about balance with diet. She's a pro at it. We're getting older and instead of going balls out.....live to lift/ski another day. Sustainability is my focus these days.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 5:59 pm 
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let's rank our favorite lifts bros


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 6:10 pm 
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--- wrote:
4/5 wrote:
--- wrote:
Self wrote:
Body types matter, you guys.

what would your ideal program look like for a taut 6' 173lb marketmonging fop who's interested in balancing gaining a moderate amount of strength, increasing overall functional athletic capacity, and staying quite lean?

crossfit is not an option

If you want to get stronger Crossfit is obviously not an option.

It depends on where you're starting from, but my advice is really simple:
For strength, follow a program centered on compound, heavy lifts. For athletic capacity, do some plyometric type of training and conditioning work. Assuming you're currently eating a maintenance level of calories, bump that up by 10% as you'll need those calories for the additional work you'll be doing. Provided that you're not eating pure junk, any weight you'll be putting on should overwhelmingly be muscle.

There are a ton of good strength programs out there, and while some may be better or worse than others it really just comes down to consistency. So pick one that you believe in and do it consistently.

Strength training 3 days a week: squats, deadlifts, bench, overhead press, chins, and cleans might be a good place to start. Google starting strength or Bill Starr for specific programs based around these exercises. You'll probably start by doing 3-5 sets of 5 reps progressively adding more weight each workout as long as you can.

Then 2-3x a week you can do your preferred conditioning/athletic activities: swimming, sprinting, circuit training, cycling, etc.

okay i'm on the right track then, this sounds pretty much like my program now. lift three times a week, focusing on compound movements and form (i'm less concerned with progressive overload than most, i suspect; i add weight only after i can do at least three sets of ten reps maintaining ideal form) and then swim two or three times a week, alternating between low/medium-intensity steady state and sprints. i limit myself to one cheat meal a week, hit the vegetables and lean proteins pretty dang hard, and have almost entirely eliminated processed junk (simple carbs and added sugars). my goal is to solicit a request from the lennytheweedwhacker account to rub my abs and/or lats.


We're not so different, when it comes to this. I did push myself too hard a few months ago and caused an injury that was a month long setback. If I could do it over again, I'd adhere to the bolded with greater fervor. It's nuts how fast muscles can go when you stop using them.

I'm also 6' and run between 164-168 with low body fat. I stick to lean protein and veggies 6 days a week. I don't go crazy for day 7, but life without the occasional comfort food and drink isn't worth living.

I get most of my cardio/conditioning from hobbies; hiking, mountain biking, swimming, dirt biking (a day on an adequately difficult trail system will kick your ass). If add a significant amount of cardio outside of this, I lose too much weight. In the winter, I'll add 2 days of cardio. I bump up the resistance of whatever I'm using, keep a pretty good pace for 20 minutes/2.5 miles, and sprint for 60 seconds on the 4s and 9s. It's been my regimen for years now and I'm happy with the results. Yours may vary.


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 6:46 pm 
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Future Drummer
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--- wrote:
let's rank our favorite lifts bros

1. Deadlift
2. Squat
1,315. Bench

Favorite bro lift
1. Shrugs

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 6:53 pm 
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thanks guys


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 6:55 pm 
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Future Drummer
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4/5 wrote:
--- wrote:
let's rank our favorite lifts bros

1. Deadlift
2. Squat
1,315. Bench

Favorite bro lift
1. Shrugs

1. landmine chest press
2. pullups
3. squat

i hate the bench press too


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 6:58 pm 
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The Master
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I fucking hate pullups more than any of them

1. Dead lifts
2. Bench press
3. Squats
4. Shoulder press (my shoulders are embarrassingly week)


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 7:01 pm 
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I've been POOSSTTIiiEEnngeeaahh
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Is cocaine not an option for you guys where you live?


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 7:02 pm 
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washing machine wrote:
Is cocaine not an option for you guys where you live?

4/5 lives in florida, so i suspect he's doing bumps at the top of every pullup movement


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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 7:13 pm 
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Future Drummer
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--- wrote:
washing machine wrote:
Is cocaine not an option for you guys where you live?

4/5 lives in florida, so i suspect he's doing bumps at the top of every pullup movement

It's really convenient when you need to chalk up before heavy pulls.
Image

_________________
"I want to see the whole picture--as nearly as I can. I don't want to put on the blinders of 'good and bad,' and limit my vision."-- In Dubious Battle



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 Post subject: Re: The Work-Out Thread
PostPosted: Thu September 13, 2018 7:32 pm 
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:haha:


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