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Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Mon July 09, 2018 4:50 pm
Mind Your Tanners
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 6:03 pm Posts: 9359 Location: Washington State
dimejinky99 wrote:
Disney haven’t stepped in to stop this fundraising campaign to remake the film. Yet.
This is heartbreaking. Fandom has learned nothing. Jake Lloyd and Ahmed best have been on the end of years of abuse since the prequels. This though puts it in perspective
Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Wed July 11, 2018 3:25 pm
Troglodyte
Joined: Wed December 19, 2012 9:53 pm Posts: 22547 Location: Chapel Hill, NC, USA
I watched this again, and I feel like Holdo is keeping a secret from Poe, not necessarily everyone. And he's acting like a spy, so I don't know that's she's making a bad decision by keeping him in the dark.
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Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Wed July 11, 2018 8:09 pm
The worst
Joined: Thu December 13, 2012 6:31 pm Posts: 39910
durdencommatyler wrote:
Monkey_Driven wrote:
bune wrote:
Yeah, I feel like we got too much of Poe's side of the story so we mistrusted her instead of him.
Yes, this was very much intentional.
aw huh
it's what made that reveal work so well (or, alternately, why it was so frustrating for some). It's not just playing entirely from Poe's POV, but movies have conditioned us to trust characters like Poe and mistrust characters like Holdo. she took Poe's rightful spot as the new resistance leader (it's somewhat subtle, but Poe is expecting to be announced as the new leader), she emasculates him (as does Leia prior, but at least we know and trust leia), she is not conventionally brave in that plucky 'fight against impossible odds because million to one shots always work' star wars way, we assume (narratively) that there has to be internal conflict within the resistance (there HAS to be a traitor, or a stuffed shirt bureaucrat getting in the way). So Holdo is set up to be the villain of Poe (and our) story when in reality she is the hero of the objective story.
Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Wed July 11, 2018 8:13 pm
what on earth am I talking about
Joined: Wed January 02, 2013 12:35 am Posts: 35487
All that clashes kinda wildly against the fact that they’ve *just* met Finn and Leia is not only telling him their plans she also shows him how Rey is gonna find them. This undermines the spy among us element of it all, for me.
Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Wed July 11, 2018 8:16 pm
Mind Your Tanners
Joined: Tue January 01, 2013 6:03 pm Posts: 9359 Location: Washington State
For me it's not so much the spy aspect but the fact that Leia's told him several times that to be a leader he has to lead, not to act just for the sake of needing to blow something up. He does not do this and it leads to brash decisions by him and makes him look like a fool.
Post subject: Re: Star Wars: Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
Posted: Wed July 11, 2018 8:24 pm
what on earth am I talking about
Joined: Wed January 02, 2013 12:35 am Posts: 35487
bune wrote:
For me it's not so much the spy aspect but the fact that Leia's told him several times that to be a leader he has to lead, not to act just for the sake of needing to blow something up. He does not do this and it leads to brash decisions by him and makes him look like a fool.
He’s learned that by the end tho. I see what Johnson was doing with him here and it’s a good arc he goes on.
Hopefully it’s built upon in 9 and JJ doesn’t keep him being the dangerous fly boy
Yeah, I feel like we got too much of Poe's side of the story so we mistrusted her instead of him.
Yes, this was very much intentional.
aw huh
it's what made that reveal work so well (or, alternately, why it was so frustrating for some). It's not just playing entirely from Poe's POV, but movies have conditioned us to trust characters like Poe and mistrust characters like Holdo. she took Poe's rightful spot as the new resistance leader (it's somewhat subtle, but Poe is expecting to be announced as the new leader), she emasculates him (as does Leia prior, but at least we know and trust leia), she is not conventionally brave in that plucky 'fight against impossible odds because million to one shots always work' star wars way, we assume (narratively) that there has to be internal conflict within the resistance (there HAS to be a traitor, or a stuffed shirt bureaucrat getting in the way). So Holdo is set up to be the villain of Poe (and our) story when in reality she is the hero of the objective story.
Exactly.
I will say (Burt, you know I'm right) that if Holdo had been a man, the backlash/frustration would have been mitigated. But, yes, regardless of all of that, which I thing is just noise and distraction and beside the point, I 100% agree with your analysis (as usual) Stip.
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