I think its maybe the first 'compromised' artistic decision they ever made

I prefer to associate everybody with their avatars.

i usually have arms, though

I just imagine you as a human Zoidberg. Zany, out of touch, slightly dangerous, heart in the right place.

My favourite is Skitch, though. In my head, he's a slightly angry, put upon Doctor Hibbert whose life revolves around the missus.

years ago I had a bender avatar, but he's not really me

I dont have it stip! IOS7 update killed everything, ive been battling with it for months..maybe its in the brooklyn show thread..ill check later..

off to meet a fellow RMer on his honeymoon (they picked Dublin..i have to try make it better)

It really comes down to what you think an album is trying to accomplish or express. If you think that no code is a record about "Eddie Vedder drops some wisdom on you" then it probably feels like it has a lot of problems or is a disorganized mess.

If you think that it's a record about escaping the weight of the past and trying to think about your self in terms of your future, after a long period of being unable to do that, then it makes a lot more sense. The disorganization, the contradiction, the disrupted thoughts and bipolar spasms and small self and I could be new and dreaming a new self up for himself et cetera.

It's no different than with the last record we discussed. If what you hear in Vitalogy is a collection of depressed or angry songs, then the ending to immortality probably feels like a really good way to cap it all off. But if you hear it as a record about the need for change…to change and be changed and witness change and change the way the world responds to you...then that ending feels like an incomplete thought and pry to becomes a part of the story...a churning surrealist swirl showcasing the most base desires stemming from dissatisfaction alongside teasing dares to respond to, suppress, or deny it ("my spanking...that's the only thing I want so much.")

So these threads ask people to start from the question of "what is wrong with this record," when the real starting point is "what do you think this record is about, or what is it trying to accomplish?"

No Code is perfect. And it was the best thing the band could do at the time too...my only complaint is that they left some really cool songs out from those sessions.

People rarely dispute what Stupid Mop is trying to accomplish, they just don't think it does it very well. The vision well exceeded the grasp of the execution.

And I can concede (and would probably agree with) everything you said about No Code without changing the fact that in key songs (like I'm Open) the execution is a bit clumsy, and that the desire to express yourself still starts to read either a bit too much like an advice column (present tense), heavy handed musings that are a bit too in love with their own profundity (Off he Goes) or is otherwise just not as compelling as the caged need on the earlier records.

And I've always thought that the 'there's No Code!' excuse for the disorganization of the record is a dodge, especially because, ultimately, No Code is meant to be useful to the listener--let me map my journey so you can more easily undertake yours. It is not a self contained snap shot of a particularly messy moment in time that exists only to document that moment.



for some of these comments, absolutely.

I am not a fan of Off He Goes in the least. But we've had this discussion elsewhere.

Even once you're past that, though, there is always the question of whether or not it does it well.

Of course, I completely agree. This kind of thread is the whole reason I'm on any message board, let alone RM specifically. I adore this kind of conversation.

But What Is Each Album Trying To Do? and subsequently, Does It Do It Well? are different questions, and perhaps much more valuable and/or interesting than What is Each Album's Major Flaw, I think.

I guess, maybe it's asking the same question from the other side of the mirror. Either way, for me No Code is a hard album to pin down. It's not my favorite Pearl Jam album, but I have a hard time calling it majorly flawed. And I think a simple answer like "Habit is the album's major flaw" is tired and lame. Totally uninteresting and unhelpful.

Habit embodies everything that I dislike about No Code. But Hail Hail, In My Tree, Present Tense, Off He Goes, Smile, Red Mosquito and Around the Bend embody things I love about the band Pearl Jam.

There is a disorganized quality to the record, sure. But I don't think that's a flaw. The production is stellar, but still the album has some sort of (I've used this before and I can't think of a better way to put it, even if I can't fully explain what I mean) underwater quality that I struggle with. So is that the album's major flaw?

While so many of my friends felt letdown and deflated by No Code when it first dropped, I felt invigorated and lightened. The album was a complete surprise and I embraced it. No Code was my favorite band doing something unexpected and kicking my ass with it. The album was a bit of a puzzle that required some unpacking. But that isn't a flaw. I had to keep listening to it, keep digging, keep searching for what the heart of the thing. I wouldn't trade that struggle for anything.

So what is it trying to do? I think McP nailed that. Does it do it well, yes. I think it does. So how is it flawed? That underwater quality, missed opportunities like I'm Open and Mankind, wrong turns like Habit. What is it's "major" flaw? That somehow, even with all it does perfectly, with all it achieves and with all its mystery and joy, it still isn't my favorite Pearl Jam album.

I’m firmly in the love No Code camp. I was probably at the height of my PJ fandom when it was released, also a time at which I was buying almost all of my music on vinyl. To have such an amazingly put together record package sold me before I heard the first note. It really bears mention that this was one of the most lovingly created vinyl packages of all time. It was obviously put together with tremendous care and at great expense to the band. Few “regular” releases have been so ambitious in terms of packaging. Maybe for a $100 deluxe edition or something, but I think I paid twelve bucks for No Code, still sealed.

As for the music, I’d probably put No Code juuuuust behind Vitalogy for my top PJ record. But it’s a different record from the first three for sure. What were they trying to accomplish? I think it’s obvious that they were trying to shed some of their mook/jock/knuckle-dragging fanbase. Mission fully accomplished. They’ve never recovered and I often wonder if they now regret it.

I was recently reading a book about U2 (the stories behind every song), and I’m pretty sure it was Achtung Baby where Bono says they were trying to make a record that played to their weaknesses, rather than their strengths. That’s an incredibly bold move, and one that very few musicians have the balls to attempt, let alone to pull off. It succeeds wildly here. It’s hard to remember in retrospect how truly different No Code was from its predecessors. Much of it sounded nothing like the Pearl Jam we had come to know and love. It pushed boundaries in all sorts of new directions. It tried hard and succeeded, something PJ does not always accomplish.

I loved No Code from the first note and still do, and a number of my all-time favorite songs are on here. I would not like PJ nearly as much without No Code. It also opened them up to being more experimental (Binaural is the true follow up to No Code), although I’m not sure the results were ever as fully realized as they are here.

The fatal flaw? It’s damned-near perfect, but I’m Open is superfluous and not that interesting. This is the one place where they tried to do something “out there” and fell flat. Push Me, Pull Me is the same sort of thing, only with much better results. So cut I’m Open from the track listing and you have a record full of songs as perfect as Vitalogy, minus the filler/non-songs that dotted that album. It’s a brilliant album, both musically and in fulfilling its intent, one that only gets better over time.

I find this thread offensive. Remove immediately.

Their greatest album. Its biggest flaw is probably that stupid moss line in "Who You Are".

Stupid Moss

No, yeah, forget everything I said before. This is right.

It has been aforementioned previously.