What is Each Album's Major Flaw?: Vitalogy

[stip]

old thread archived here

This is a multi-part series for each album. We'll move on to the next album when it seems like it's been discussed enough. I'd like to reiterate that the aim of these discussions is to hear opinions on what you think is the single most significant flaw for the album being discussed. We're not looking for general album bashing, but rather a critical look at the single biggest weakness for each record.

Example of a poor post:
There are so many things that suck on this album. Track 4, 8 and 9 are terrible and the lyrics for such and such a song a really bad. Not only that, but the cover is stupid.

Like I said, we're not looking for general album bashing. What I suggest is to go give a listen to the album being discussed. For some of us, it's been a while listening to these older albums all the way through, and it helps you think and take that critical view before you post. Try and be insightful and give good reasons why you believe the flaw you're pointing out is the biggest flaw of the album.

[stip]

Nothing, really. Just some minor gripes. I think the live, cleaner versions of Satan's Bed are a bit better than the studio. Maybe I would have liked Mike to be a bit more prominent in some of the extended jams (but maybe not since it's not like the songs aren't awesome as is). I go back and forth on this, but stupid mop doesn't really need to be here, is kinda silly, and if it existed it should have been a hidden track. It would have been cool to give Aye Davinita some words.

All minor stuff, really (except perhaps for stupid mop). Their best songwriting on any album, an amazing guitar tone, excellent performances, and the last time Eddie sounded perfect. As good as music gets. Its only real flaw is that it ends.

[stip]

To continue with the stupid mop point, since I assume that's what most of this thread will revolve around, I really love the ambiguous way Immortality ends--the way the rising intonation at the end of 'some day just to live' makes it as much a question as a statement, and then it gently floats away on a rocky but oddly peaceful outro. We don't know if it's the peace that comes from the promise of release and ending in a sought after death (someone watching the blood flow out of their body, and the pain with it--a romantic view of suicide but immortality is a romantic song in that way) or the peace that comes from accepting that this is where and who you are, and you have to accept that and move forward (The Camusian read that I have of the album). It's a very powerful statement, and a very complete statement despite its lack of a definitive interpretation.


What is Stupid Mop adding to that? Especially by adding in a new character and clothing them in faux shocking statements that are trying way too hard to provoke. It's a pretty heavy handed postscript to what was a very graceful conclusion.

[Release_Me]

The flaws on Vitalogy are the non-songs I mostly ignore and pretend that don't exist. Bugs, Aye Davanita, Pry, To and Stupid Mop. The rest of the album is so great that it doesn't really matter. Amongst the proper songs, Whipping is the only slight disappointment.

[stip]

Pry to is maybe a little too precious

[Release_Me]

Aye Davanita and Bugs at least have something going for them if I'm in the right mood. The other two, not so much.

[bada]

I don't have an issue with any of the songs first three albums except Foxy Mop which isn't a song so much as an Eddie Vedder sound collage that he snuck on the album in a half power play half trying to hard. I'm alternative too guys. No one else in the band wanted it on there. Foxy Mop was the moment Stone checked out.

[bodysnatcher]

Vitalogy is flawless in my book. The "non songs" that people tend to think are the weak points are this album's strong points in my opinion.

[Lament]

Vitalogy is flawless in my book.

I agree with this wise, wise gentlemen.

[BurtReynolds]

Betterman

[Kevin Davis]

What is Stupid Mop adding to that? Especially by adding in a new character and clothing them in faux shocking statements that are trying way too hard to provoke. It's a pretty heavy handed postscript to what was a very graceful conclusion.

The thing is, I can understand wanting to end the album on something other than ''Immortality,'' which almost feels a little too perfectly ''final''; if ''Immortality'' is ''some die just to live,'' I like the idea of following that up with a seven minute drone to symbolize the dying (or the living?), or to at least give the listener some space to ponder whatever he or she wants. It's all down to that stupid voice-over, which just makes it feel like a hamfisted collegiate art piece. I never listen to it and agree that it's the worst thing about Vitalogy.

[Jorge]

It sounds like those Marilyn Manson secret tracks from the 90s that are supposed to be scary but are actually hilarious.

Also, "Betterman" is a good song, Burt, so shut up.

[Kaius]

Bugs is annoying sometimes.

[Birds in Hell]

Also, "Betterman" is a good song, Burt, so shut up.

It is.

I certainly agree that Stupid Mop is far and away the album's most egregious flaw. The samples are juvenile and the music isn't compelling in the slightest.

I wish Satan's Bed was a band performance too; the drum loops leave it feeling too stiff and somewhat restrained. I wonder why they never tried another take with Dave before finishing up the recording sessions?

[Birds in Hell]

Bugs is annoying sometimes.

I think so too.

[BurtReynolds]

Also, "Betterman" is a good song, Burt, so shut up.

It is.

I certainly agree that Stupid Mop is far and away the album's most egregious flaw. The samples are juvenile and the music isn't compelling in the slightest.

I wish Satan's Bed was a band performance too; the drum loops leave it feeling too stiff and somewhat restrained. I wonder why they never tried another take with Dave before finishing up the recording sessions?

Stupid Mop doesn't bother me. Its at the end anyway. I can just turn it off. Its Master/Slave stuff.

Bettermen is a good song, but its out of place on this album, and its not that great.

But I'm nitpicking.

[McParadigm]

You guys are garbage who deserve all the Lightning Bolt you can eat, and Nothingman is the low point.

[BurtReynolds]

you're a lightning bolt!

[stip]

Betterman is a great song, and the fact that you can make a serious case for either Nothingman OR Betterman being the worst song on this album just goes to show how great it is.


I wouldn't put Nothingman at the bottom, but it is the song that has fallen the furthest in my appreciation

[Norris]

The Monkeywrench Radio performance of Nothingman is one of my favorite things.