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Rate Riot Act
5 Stars: A top tier album 22%  22%  [ 22 ]
4 Stars: A very good album 46%  46%  [ 46 ]
3 Stars: Average 24%  24%  [ 24 ]
2: Stars: I expect more 6%  6%  [ 6 ]
1 Star: Embarrassing 1%  1%  [ 1 ]
Total votes : 99
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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:05 pm 
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in a lot of ways it is that last string of songs that really cements the record

Help Help (help me)

Bushleaguer (blackout weaves its way through the city/I remember when you sang that song about today now it's tomorrow and everything has changed)

1/2 Full (won't someone save the world)

All or None (pretty much all of it)

how do you hear those songs?

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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Stip wrote:
yeah, KD's word choice is better, in particular resignation. But I don't like that in Pearl Jam. I'm sure I said this in the tour threads somewhere but Riot Act and Binaural are both records that I think are well crafted and the things I don't like often reflect my unwillingness as a listener to go along for the ride more than the ride itself. I think that's an important distinction (and one of the things that often rubs me the wrong way about a lot of Backspacer bitching)

That is an important distinction. At least you recognize that, or are willing to recognize that in yourself. That's not something everyone can do - or likes to do. I know I've been guilty of the same thing. Though it is something I try to fight through.

For me, I think the resignation is a necessary symptom of the record they tried to write. But, again, I think it's as much about overcoming those feelings as it is about giving into them.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:07 pm 
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durdencommatyler wrote:
For me, I think the resignation is a necessary symptom of the record they tried to write. But, again, I think it's as much about overcoming those feelings as it is about giving into them.


I agree. I'm just not convinced by the 'overcoming' part. I think the next record hits that much more effectively

I should try and find the time to listen to Riot Act and S/T back to back since the second is so obviously a musical response to the former.

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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:14 pm 
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Stip wrote:
in a lot of ways it is that last string of songs that really cements the record

Help Help (help me)

Bushleaguer (blackout weaves its way through the city/I remember when you sang that song about today now it's tomorrow and everything has changed)

1/2 Full (won't someone save the world)

All or None (pretty much all of it)

how do you hear those songs?

I think those are oversimplifications.

HelpHelp, for example, isn't a cry for help at all. It's about overcoming your own blindness. It's a song about waking up. The first verse is very much a "I'm happy in my little shell of lies, please only tell me what I want to hear" verse. But it's satiric.

Then the song shifts into waking up from that self-imposed delirium/ignorance. The more we read, the more we see, the more clear it becomes that this is no way to be.

The "help me" plea becomes one of fighting. As in, help me overcome this blindness. I'm seeing clearly and I want you to help me in my cause. It's a call to arms at this point.

Ending the song on "no, not my enemy" is important. It's a statement of power, a statement of refusing to fall victim to all those words like "fatalism" and "defeatism" and "resignation."


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:19 pm 
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All or None is certainly a resigned song. It's worn out from the fight. But I think it's important that the refrain is "but I still try to run on." Even the idea of all or none can be seen as a valiant statement about winning at all costs.

Ed's delivery and the atmosphere of the song are certainly dark and battle worn. There is a sense that things might not be okay. The album doesn't end on an overtly triumphant note, I grant you.

But the album as a whole, as a journey, is a lot brighter, I think, than most give it credit for.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:19 pm 
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the ending of help, help is sounds so good i never really stopped to think about the lyrics. great, great tune. i wish mike was louder though.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:20 pm 
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Yeah, helphelp is a fantastic song. One of my favorites from Riot Act. And I love it live as well.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:27 pm 
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I have to agree with stip in that Riot Act, along with Binaural are the darkest and most despondent moments of the PJ catalog (with Vitalogy right behind them). That being said, I don't for a second think that the mood it inhabits and the fact that it ends in a dark place is a knock against the record. Sometimes albums should end in a dark place.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 4:43 pm 
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digster wrote:
I have to agree with stip in that Riot Act, along with Binaural are the darkest and most despondent moments of the PJ catalog (with Vitalogy right behind them). That being said, I don't for a second think that the mood it inhabits and the fact that it ends in a dark place is a knock against the record. Sometimes albums should end in a dark place.

I agree. And obviously, I love Riot Act for all that it is. My point is just that I don't think the album is as (dark isn't the right word, because it is dark) despondent or resigned as many others do. I think Riot Act has a lot of fight in it.

I certainly don't think it's as dark or despondent as Vitalogy. And Vitalogy is my favorite PJ album.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 5:19 pm 
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durdencommatyler wrote:
Stip wrote:
in a lot of ways it is that last string of songs that really cements the record

Help Help (help me)

Bushleaguer (blackout weaves its way through the city/I remember when you sang that song about today now it's tomorrow and everything has changed)

1/2 Full (won't someone save the world)

All or None (pretty much all of it)

how do you hear those songs?

I think those are oversimplifications.

HelpHelp, for example, isn't a cry for help at all. It's about overcoming your own blindness. It's a song about waking up. The first verse is very much a "I'm happy in my little shell of lies, please only tell me what I want to hear" verse. But it's satiric.

Then the song shifts into waking up from that self-imposed delirium/ignorance. The more we read, the more we see, the more clear it becomes that this is no way to be.

The "help me" plea becomes one of fighting. As in, help me overcome this blindness. I'm seeing clearly and I want you to help me in my cause. It's a call to arms at this point.

Ending the song on "no, not my enemy" is important. It's a statement of power, a statement of refusing to fall victim to all those words like "fatalism" and "defeatism" and "resignation."


yeah that's fair

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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 5:22 pm 
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digster wrote:
I have to agree with stip in that Riot Act, along with Binaural are the darkest and most despondent moments of the PJ catalog (with Vitalogy right behind them). That being said, I don't for a second think that the mood it inhabits and the fact that it ends in a dark place is a knock against the record. Sometimes albums should end in a dark place.



I agree. Like I said while I have some issues with some of the songs on those records whatever issues I have with the concepts come more from me missing the light that I look for in them rather than a problem with the concepts themselves. Pearl Jam not writing the song I wanted them to write is not their fault.

Interestingly enough none of this bothered me on Vitalogy, which is also really dark. Perhaps it is the quality of the songs. Maybe it is because I heard Vitalogy before I really had strong opinions about what pearl jam should be.

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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 5:29 pm 
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Stip wrote:
digster wrote:
I have to agree with stip in that Riot Act, along with Binaural are the darkest and most despondent moments of the PJ catalog (with Vitalogy right behind them). That being said, I don't for a second think that the mood it inhabits and the fact that it ends in a dark place is a knock against the record. Sometimes albums should end in a dark place.



I agree. Like I said while I have some issues with some of the songs on those records whatever issues I have with the concepts come more from me missing the light that I look for in them rather than a problem with the concepts themselves. Pearl Jam not writing the song I wanted them to write is not their fault.

Interestingly enough none of this bothered me on Vitalogy, which is also really dark. Perhaps it is the quality of the songs. Maybe it is because I heard Vitalogy before I really had strong opinions about what pearl jam should be.

The Pearl Jam that wrote those first three albums is a pretty different band from the one that wrote those subsequent three.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 6:08 pm 
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durdencommatyler wrote:
Yeah, helphelp is a fantastic song. One of my favorites from Riot Act. And I love it live as well.


Id probably still call all or none my favorite off of riot act, but help,help is very close to it for me. And i still havent gotten all or none live to compair it, but help,help is a highlight of the show whenever i get it


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 6:12 pm 
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Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:
durdencommatyler wrote:
Yeah, helphelp is a fantastic song. One of my favorites from Riot Act. And I love it live as well.


Id probably still call all or none my favorite off of riot act, but help,help is very close to it for me. And i still havent gotten all or none live to compair it, but help,help is a highlight of the show whenever i get it

All or None is a hard sell in a live setting, I think. It's beautiful. But the couple of times I've seen it, I'm loved it; basked in it! But you can kinda feel the energy in the room dissipate. And then they have to work extra hard to fight to get it back again (see what I did there ;) ).


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 6:19 pm 
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durdencommatyler wrote:
Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:
durdencommatyler wrote:
Yeah, helphelp is a fantastic song. One of my favorites from Riot Act. And I love it live as well.


Id probably still call all or none my favorite off of riot act, but help,help is very close to it for me. And i still havent gotten all or none live to compair it, but help,help is a highlight of the show whenever i get it

All or None is a hard sell in a live setting, I think. It's beautiful. But the couple of times I've seen it, I'm loved it; basked in it! But you can kinda feel the energy in the room dissipate. And then they have to work extra hard to fight to get it back again (see what I did there ;) ).


Yeah yeah yeah ? :lol:

Ive always wanted to see all or none as an opener, then a slow build into a crazy fast end to the first set


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sat January 05, 2013 6:21 pm 
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Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:
durdencommatyler wrote:
Dr. Van Nostrand wrote:
durdencommatyler wrote:
Yeah, helphelp is a fantastic song. One of my favorites from Riot Act. And I love it live as well.


Id probably still call all or none my favorite off of riot act, but help,help is very close to it for me. And i still havent gotten all or none live to compair it, but help,help is a highlight of the show whenever i get it

All or None is a hard sell in a live setting, I think. It's beautiful. But the couple of times I've seen it, I'm loved it; basked in it! But you can kinda feel the energy in the room dissipate. And then they have to work extra hard to fight to get it back again (see what I did there ;) ).


Yeah yeah yeah ? :lol:

Ive always wanted to see all or none as an opener, then a slow build into a crazy fast end to the first set

That would be great in a more modest venue. Would love to see that in a setting smaller than the Garden.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sun January 06, 2013 2:03 am 
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I saw a perfect version of "All or None" at the 2004 Vote for Change show in St. Louis. It was in a theater rather than an arena (the beautiful Fox Theater), and it was during the "slow first encore" part of the show where--miraculously perhaps--everyone was sitting down and paying attention. Definitely one of my favorite memories of seeing PJ live.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sun January 06, 2013 2:30 am 
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Kevin Davis wrote:
I saw a perfect version of "All or None" at the 2004 Vote for Change show in St. Louis. It was in a theater rather than an arena (the beautiful Fox Theater), and it was during the "slow first encore" part of the show where--miraculously perhaps--everyone was sitting down and paying attention. Definitely one of my favorite memories of seeing PJ live.

I was at that show. Also, one of my favorite PJ live memories. Great show.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sun January 06, 2013 2:33 am 
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Man, I'll admit, my life feels a little richer now that I know I was once in the same room as you, dct. If only I knew you when.


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 Post subject: Re: Riot Act: Official Album Thread
PostPosted: Sun January 06, 2013 2:38 am 
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Kevin Davis wrote:
Man, I'll admit, my life feels a little richer now that I know I was once in the same room as you, dct. If only I knew you when.

:luv:

Mighty kind of ya, friend. And the feeling is beyond mutual.

I think this is the first time I've made this connection with another RMer. Feels good.


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