Wed November 13, 2013 10:11 pm
Wed November 13, 2013 10:12 pm
Wed November 13, 2013 10:13 pm
BurtReynolds wrote:I love this thread. It's like RM's communal cum receptacle.
Wed November 13, 2013 10:36 pm
IlluminEddie wrote:stupidmop wrote: Cool, I get all that I guess, but I think personally if the band ran things got to a point where I thought they were sickening I'd have to step back from the band a little.
See, I don't understand how someone who agrees with Ed on most political issues, couldn't find it sickening. That's the irony. I don't really agree with him (most often). So, when he or the band do things that come across as hypocritical (on greed or whatnot), it kinda just shows his original POV was off. I would think that the band "selling-out" per se, would affect those against corporate greed, etc. more than someone who's a capitalist. Think about it.stupidmop wrote:I definitely believe the band should get a little shit for some of their recent decisions. Though, I say band because I know ed has the Mic and we get to hear what he has to say more than the other guys, he's not single handedly making the decisions, I have a niggling suspicion that at least some of the discrepancies between what ed says and the band does is down to him conceding to the band on things.
I understand your point. But, just using that interview, for example. Ed's the guy who did that. He said that. He's offered no apology. He's also the guy who did the axe throwing and so on. You can say, well axe toss competition stuff isn't as bad as guns. I get all that. The point is, the guy isn't really even considering it. I mean, if you're going to go into an interview and spout off on an issue like that. AND. You're going to have ads for your new album with you wielding deadly weapons... perhaps, you could at least apologize? Say it came out wrong. Or something. To me, I feel like it really did not come out wrong. Which I hope you'd agree, is fucked up "IF" that's the case.
On the band - I think Ed has pretty much all the control. If he says no, do that and we're through.... I think they listen.stupidmop wrote:Wasn't he best friends with johnny ramone who was a republican? I assume they had more than a few differing opinions. (I might be thinking about someone else here).
I could have predicted this on His one 'different' friend. Yes, I believe they were friends. That doesn't make Ed open-minded. To have one republican friend who was also a rock star doesn't take away what I was saying before. I don't think he's open-minded.
stupidmop wrote:I guess to me I put down most of the discrepancies( though I don't usually think about this shit unless it comes up here) in what he says due to the fact that we're only getting snapshots or soundbites of him talking. Like everyone has already mentioned he's not the best or most comfortable public speaker, we don't know what its like to have an actual conversation with him, for all we know he could be an amazing conversationalist when there's not a camera in his face, or a reporter writing things down or thousands of people standing in front of him.
I honestly think it's possible to defend anyone of anything they've done or said with this sort of logic. In fact, I think Ed fans do that frequently. I think it's probably true that he's not a great public speaker. But, truth be told, I don't think he seems like he's having a tough time with interviews and I'm not so sure this really is "public speaking". I think he gets rambling and states what he feels. I actually think that's what he thinks.
I won't give him the pass on having a camera there or it being a "tough" interview because it's one of his friends in his band's practice studio. Seems kinda scapegoating to pretend it's the interview situation, to me. I truly believe this is who Ed is.stupidmop wrote:And you could say maybe he shouldnt be talking about things in public at all then, but I think he'd rather feel like he's raising awareness or getting people talking, which he is, if this thread is anything to go by. Plus its not like we've seen him shut down someone trying to have a debate with him, someone asked him a question and he answered.
I think he rambles. And I think he thinks about these things often. I don't believe he thinks about them critically, however. So, when he gets rambling, he thinks of one of these topics, and baam.... out comes a line that the press will talk about.
Do I think he could control this? Yes. I do. I think he doesn't want to. Once again, I bet he does think about these things. Critically - no. But, he does probably read what Zinn had to say or something of that nature. Which ironically, circles him back to passion, which circles him back to making these mistakes. Yet, they aren't mistakes... because we hear no apology.
He has never debated anyone - ever publically (other than an large portion of a crowd with the BUsh thing) to my knowlege. So, the part on a debate, not sure where that's coming from. In fact, that's kinda my point. He only allows himself to speak either when he has the mic or in interview situations where he won't be challenged. In a sense, he likes to live in a bubble.stupidmop wrote:I still think its easier to kill some one with a gun than an axe. Do you think if there were axe sprees at schools and in malls and on the streets on the regular, and people wanted to ban axes, he'd start ranting about his right to own an axe and chop his own wood?
I think it's easier to hurt someone accidentally with a axe tossing game situated in one's house, then it is to have a small fire arm (used for target practice) locked up upstairs. Let's just say they are equal. My point is - how does he get off telling "everyone" who has a gun (even those who are good with it) that he wishes them ill? I think that's kinda sick. I honestly can't see how anyone would defend it.
Wed November 13, 2013 10:39 pm
harmless wrote:People are still engaging IlluminEddie in discussion?
Wed November 13, 2013 11:14 pm
Thu November 14, 2013 1:50 am
Heathen wrote:BurtReynolds wrote:I love this thread. It's like RM's communal cum receptacle.
hey now, malice posted in it too
Thu November 14, 2013 3:04 am
stupidmop wrote:I guess we're just gonna disagree because when it comes down to it don't think him 'almost wishing bad things on people' is that big a deal. That's like the most polite non rant in the world. It's like when you see a car flying down the road way too fast and you think it'll serve him right if he crashes. Maybe because I'm a cold hearted asshole? British? Whatever
Thu November 14, 2013 3:18 am
Thu November 14, 2013 3:20 am
Thu November 14, 2013 11:29 am
IlluminEddie wrote:onawave wrote:wtf.
trying to make sense of some of these posts.
big sweeping change is the hardest thing to pull off in government. im not "arguing" on the how it should be done. im making a point on that these kinds of program's work in other countries, your CURRENT government is trying to make some progress in making the USA a better place to live. (imho)
Yes, that's your opinion. And you're entitled to it. But, my opinion on your opinion is - most likely, whereever it is you live is quite small (population-wise, economy-wise, everything-wise) relative to the US. So, most likely, you have no idea what you're talking about.onawave wrote:i mean holy fuk. every time someone tries to change a law for the better over there, some idiot brings up the one of your amendments and pokes holes in it or hides behind it.
Let's stop for a moment. The law is thousands of pages long. The key wording here is "for the better". Earlier you said, I'm "not arguing how it should be done". I'd say, you kinda are. Do you honestly think that the thousands of pages could include some elements pretty much every single human could disagree with? In our country, this is known as pork. Why does one have to agree with a bill that includes loads of pork and other (largely unrelated) laws in order to pass the underlying initiative that they agree with?
Personally, I disagree with the basics behind the desire for this sort of law. I can understand that someone may disagree with me. However, supporting "this law" and how "this law" was "done" and saying it's "making things better" (at least thus far) is straight-up laughable.onawave wrote:basic healthcare for everyone? again im not arguing on how its been implemented, im on the side of the fence that this shit fuking works. its not going to be perfect, but holy shit it has to be better than what u have now.
How do you know it's better than what we have now? Once again, you probably don't. It's a counterfactual. The US is the largest economy in the world. Trying to change healthcare could result in a better system, or could even make things worse. The truth is - we're all just expressing "opinions".onawave wrote:im not even going to entertain the spying debate. read the topic.
You're not going to entertain the spying debate? Honestly, why? You're obviously from another country. So, you're OK with the US spying on everything your elected leaders do? Are you OK with them lying about it? Are you OK with them trying to silence and put the guy in a prison hole who made it public information? How about them spying on you? Is that cool? Every single thing you type, you say, etc. I'd say it's beyond f'd up. And if our favorite lead singer had any integrity to points he's made in the past (see Grievance), he'd agree.
In short, I suggest you read about it.onawave wrote:getting back to ed. i %100 agree with the dude. imagine if tighter gun controls just even saved one kids life. WINNING
What happens if they didn't? But, for arguments sake, let's say they do help save a few children's lives. But, once again, for argument's sake, what if the government did start to extend spying.... and started to behave more totalitarian. What if we fell into a depression and the US government got out of control? What if we were hit by another terrorist attack and more of our freedoms were removed? Seriously, this is "possible". Is it likely? Depends on perspective. But, it's possible. Some, crazy as it is, don't trust government. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that point of view.
Also, some use guns for recreational activities. Ed uses giant axes. I'd say giant axes, used in a game where they are thrown, are pretty dangerous. Should they be outlawed? Where's the line drawn? And - why? And - are we honoring the 2nd amendment in doing so? These are all reasonable questions.onawave wrote:now the counter argument is that people need these guns for self defence. if this is actually true, well america has lost the battle with itself already.
Huh?
Thu November 14, 2013 11:39 am
stupidmop wrote:I guess we're just gonna disagree because when it comes down to it don't think him 'almost wishing bad things on people' is that big a deal. That's like the most polite non rant in the world. It's like when you see a car flying down the road way too fast and you think it'll serve him right if he crashes. Maybe because I'm a cold hearted asshole? British? Whatever
Thu November 14, 2013 1:06 pm
Thu November 14, 2013 1:46 pm
stupidmop wrote:I've spent way too much time in this thread stating an opinion that could be summed up by 'ehh'.
Thu November 14, 2013 2:19 pm
music.for.rhinos wrote:I think you've been quite clear about your opinion, illumineddie, so at this point you have to realize people either get it or they won't. Since we all love metaphors and analogies: you can keep beating it, but it can't get any more dead.
Thu November 14, 2013 2:31 pm
broken iris wrote:stupidmop wrote:I guess we're just gonna disagree because when it comes down to it don't think him 'almost wishing bad things on people' is that big a deal. That's like the most polite non rant in the world. It's like when you see a car flying down the road way too fast and you think it'll serve him right if he crashes. Maybe because I'm a cold hearted asshole? British? Whatever
Ed rant history suggests to us that he doesn't mean it like you do, but I get your point. One of the Baristas at the Starbucks in my office building is really lazy and slows down the entire line to the point of the regulars rolling their eyes when they get in his queue. I often think "Hey asshole, you are in your late thirties and working at a cash register, do you think maybe it has something to with that neck tattoo that says "the chocolate factory?", but then I realize this guy could have had the shittiest life of all time and I shouldn't judge. I really never get that vibe from Vedder. On some issues, guns and God in particular, he seems pretty judge-y and unwilling to even look at the other side.
Thu November 14, 2013 8:23 pm
Thu November 14, 2013 8:27 pm
Thu November 14, 2013 8:34 pm
Fri November 15, 2013 3:19 am